An advert in Poland for bank loans featuring ex-Python John Cleese has caused a bit of a fuss. Cleese managed not to mention the war in the ad, but he did mention the Germans. Cue lights, camera...controversy.
The advert made the evening news a couple of days ago and everyone seems to have an opinion about it.
The ad – for Bank Zachodni WBK S.A, whose major share holder these days is Allied Irish – features Cleese in a television studio in Poland preparing to film an advert and talking to the director how he would like one of these loans (how very Po Mo).
See the ad here. (it's in English).
The controversy comes from the last line, obviously, when Cleese, desperately wanting a cheap loan from BZ WBK bank, says: “But I can speak Polish: Guten Morgen!”
Titter, titter.
An attention grabbing, but not very funny advert, all in all, and very typical of John Cleese’s career over the past three decades. After the amazing success of Fawlty Towers – made in the mid 1970s, let’s remember – he all but gave up on comedy and started writing books and making films on cod-psychology. He is also a famous money whore, frequently making not that good adverts which trade on a time when the guy was one of the most talented comedy writers and performers Britain has ever produced.
The Polish bank advert references perhaps the most famous of Fawlty Towers episodes – ‘The Germans’, where Basil, disorientated from a bang on the head when he was putting a moose’s head up on the wall under strict orders from his purple hared, parana fish of a wife, Cybil, is confronted by a group of German guests at his ‘hotel’. The catch phrase, “Don’t mention the war,’ and the famous goose stepping have entered British comedy folklore.
Listening to people talk about it today at work, the problem appears to be that: “You see, most Poles don’t know Fawlty Towers and just find the advert insulting.”
So, because ‘most Poles feel insulted’ by the advert it therefore must be a bad advert.
The truth is a little different. Any advert that can make it onto the evening news – and an advert using subtitles, at that, with no horrid Polish voice over, like most things on the television here - is a very good advert, indeed. It was probably focus grouped, as most ads are these days, on the target group that the bank hoped would be their future customers. The focus group gave it the green light.
They probably calculated the type of people who might feel insulted by this – the old, the nationalist, the Kaczynski, Lepper, Giertych supporting Radio Maryja listening, mohair beret wearer, maybe – was not the type of person who might be coming to the bank for a loan in the first place. After all, former PM Jaroslaw Kaczynski infamously has never had a bank account and gets his mum to look after dosh for him. So any controversy that did result would just be more free air time for the advert.
The added twist to it all is that the Basil Fawlty character was a satire on what we call in Britain ‘Little Englanders’...those lower middle class, Daily Mail reading, xenophobic conservatives who are now aghast at the amount of Poles currently living and working in the UK. So a Polish equivalent of Basil getting upset about a slightly deranged Torquay hotel owning Little Englander will not be much of a problem for Bank Zachodni WBK S.A..
The advert made the evening news a couple of days ago and everyone seems to have an opinion about it.
The ad – for Bank Zachodni WBK S.A, whose major share holder these days is Allied Irish – features Cleese in a television studio in Poland preparing to film an advert and talking to the director how he would like one of these loans (how very Po Mo).
See the ad here. (it's in English).
The controversy comes from the last line, obviously, when Cleese, desperately wanting a cheap loan from BZ WBK bank, says: “But I can speak Polish: Guten Morgen!”
Titter, titter.
An attention grabbing, but not very funny advert, all in all, and very typical of John Cleese’s career over the past three decades. After the amazing success of Fawlty Towers – made in the mid 1970s, let’s remember – he all but gave up on comedy and started writing books and making films on cod-psychology. He is also a famous money whore, frequently making not that good adverts which trade on a time when the guy was one of the most talented comedy writers and performers Britain has ever produced.
The Polish bank advert references perhaps the most famous of Fawlty Towers episodes – ‘The Germans’, where Basil, disorientated from a bang on the head when he was putting a moose’s head up on the wall under strict orders from his purple hared, parana fish of a wife, Cybil, is confronted by a group of German guests at his ‘hotel’. The catch phrase, “Don’t mention the war,’ and the famous goose stepping have entered British comedy folklore.
Listening to people talk about it today at work, the problem appears to be that: “You see, most Poles don’t know Fawlty Towers and just find the advert insulting.”
So, because ‘most Poles feel insulted’ by the advert it therefore must be a bad advert.
The truth is a little different. Any advert that can make it onto the evening news – and an advert using subtitles, at that, with no horrid Polish voice over, like most things on the television here - is a very good advert, indeed. It was probably focus grouped, as most ads are these days, on the target group that the bank hoped would be their future customers. The focus group gave it the green light.
They probably calculated the type of people who might feel insulted by this – the old, the nationalist, the Kaczynski, Lepper, Giertych supporting Radio Maryja listening, mohair beret wearer, maybe – was not the type of person who might be coming to the bank for a loan in the first place. After all, former PM Jaroslaw Kaczynski infamously has never had a bank account and gets his mum to look after dosh for him. So any controversy that did result would just be more free air time for the advert.
The added twist to it all is that the Basil Fawlty character was a satire on what we call in Britain ‘Little Englanders’...those lower middle class, Daily Mail reading, xenophobic conservatives who are now aghast at the amount of Poles currently living and working in the UK. So a Polish equivalent of Basil getting upset about a slightly deranged Torquay hotel owning Little Englander will not be much of a problem for Bank Zachodni WBK S.A..
108 comments:
The reaction to the ad doesn’t surprise me a bit! As a historian-friend of mine once explained, Poles, unlike most other ethnic groups (for example Czechs), lack any sense of humor if the topic pertains to their nation, their history, their values, their religion, etc. (BTW: The same does not apply if the subject of the humor, no matter how distasteful, is some other ethnic/national group, e.g. the Jews.) According to my friend, that’s precisely why Polish literature does not have an equivalent of Hasek’s “The Good Soldier Švejk.” When Poles are faced with an example of their own paradoxical or inconsistent behavior, laughter is their natural reaction. For most Poles the natural response is anger, indignation, ranting and rambling, spitting and frothing at the mouth. That’s why we are known around the world as humorless buffoons with self-perceived sense of cultural and intellectual superiority. I’m sure the reaction to this post will prove my point.
Correction:
When I said: "When Poles are faced with an example of their own paradoxical or inconsistent behavior, laughter is their natural reaction."
I meant to say: "When Poles are faced with an example of their own paradoxical or inconsistent behavior, laughter is NOT their natural reaction."
Are dead parrots given out with every account opened?
Or live parrots that repeately screech obscenities?
I, for one, find that very line absolutely hilarious!
When Spain's Banco Santander buys into Poland will there be an ad referencing the Spanish Inquisition (nobody will expect that!)?
I brave ad, that will undoubtely get a few interested punters coming through the doors ofBank Zachodni WBK S.A.
I found it funny and somewhat shocking at the same time, and perhaps that's its greatest achievement. You remember it!!
Poles' inability to laugh at themselves is perhaps why most Poles find it difficult to stomach Gombrowicz, and why Gombrowicz found Polish society suffocating.
I saw one young man with a gigantic chip on his shoulder interviewed on the teevee saying it was an insult to Pcim! This is because in the ad Cleese claims to have an aunt from Pcim (which he pronounces correctly). I think this proves Heat Seeker's point. The Pcim local authorities are apparently lodging an official protest to whoever oversensitive humourless buffoons lodge protests to in this most self righteous of countries.
If they had any sense of humour they would know that merely mentioning a place is not the same as ridiculing it.
Link
The nearest Polish equivalent to the Good Soldier was "Imperial and Royal Deserters," by Kazimierz Sejda. In fact it's a bit too near an equivalent.
Are Poles aware of the English language Alchemy Vodka commercial that's been circulating a lot on the internet?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F00ifUs4o0Y
Should Poles laugh at themselves vis-a-vis this commecial???
Great comments these.
But in the interest of fairness and balance - qualities the beatroot is know for the world over - I should say that the British get a little prickly when someone else is taking the piss out of them...in fact most nations are not too keen on it.
But maybe Poles are a little worse than average. And that's not because of their superiority complex...it's due to their inferiroty complex - that's the problem.
beatroot said. “ their inferiority complex”
Surely you meant your own inferiority foreign infidel scum!
You’re the problem we’re the solution.
http://www.nop.org
Then in your case maybe Cleese shouldn;t have said 'Guten Morgen' he should have said "Sieg Heil!?
Um, Beatroot...your title should say Ze Germans...
Although how does it feel to be an "inferior foreign infidel scum"? That could make a cool t-shirt. And I personally find the commercial pretty funny. I will always have a soft spot for Cleese. Even if he does stupid commercials. I used to love the Schweppes commercials he used to do a long time ago.
Oh, but Poles love to criticise themselves, both seriously and with humour. Of all the world's nations, the one who hates Poles most is Poles. It's just that they cannot stand it when they are criticised by a foreigner.
I think a good analogue of Czechs' Hasek would be Bareja.
And one of more popular publicist books of last years is "Polactwo" by Rafał Ziemkiewicz. I wouldn't consider Ziemkiewicz an authority of any kind (personally, I side with his arch-nemesis, Adam Michnik), but the matter of fact is that "Polactwo" is 400 pages of ranting about how some Poles are stupid, dirty, ill behaved, evil and inferior to pretty much any other form of life. Actually, the word "Polactwo" is derived from "polaczek", a highly derogative term whose literal meaning is "little Pole".
Michnik writes books about Polish sins, too. The one I've read recently, "In the search of lost purpose", focuses on "nagonka", which is the Polish variety of witchhunt. A not so large but very vocal part of Polish society lives in a state of permanent nagonka, which usually has a strong nationalist vibe. There is a set of topics to which they react like a Pavlov's dog, that is - they start to foam. One of those is Germans. No modern nagonka can do without accusing the victim of being a German lapdog.
As for the commercial, I know a lot of people who've found it very funny. I don't own a TV, but I've seen it anyway, because I've been passed a youtube link on several occasions. I'm pretty sure one of reasons why it's so popular is that many people's first thought after watching it must have been "ooooh, Kaczynski is not going to like it". In many people's minds this commercial stands up to nagonka without making a direct reference, which is a very Polish kind of humour.
I actually haven't seen the commercial from beginning to end (I've heard part of it though).
And I agree the problem isn't that Polish people have an inflated, humorless version of themselves and their country. Quite the contrary, Poles say more intensely negative things about their compatriots and country than foreigners ever do and seem to enjoy themselves a great deal doing so. But if a foreigner agrees or adds their own contribution then the fear arises that their worst suspicions might be right...
I'd say the closest to a Szwejkish character in Polish literature would be Nikodem Dyzma, who seems to be ripped off from Chauncey Gardiner (that is after reading Being there, Dołęga-Mostowicz travelled back in time to write his novels 'first').
Overall, I'd say film has been the better medium for Polish absurdism. No country that takes itself that seriously could make (and love) movies like Sami swoi, Miś, Wyjście aweryjne or Alternatywy 4 (among others).
Sizzlingly good comment box at the moment, with the obvious exception.
Can't compete with the two previous very elegant comments, so I won't even try.
Yes, it's obvious Poles rip themselves to bits - in a way it reminds me of the way Arabs do it about themselves. One of the reasons why Arabs were sceptical that 9/11 was done by them (hence a million conspiracy theory) is that they just don't believe Arabs could be that organized. It's a joke they say about themselves, of course, but they are half serious. And I can imagine Poles coming up with something similar.
When Poland won the right to host Euro 2012, there was euphoria in the room where I was for a minute...and then everyone calmed down and started to say: "We are never going to make it. Never."
But yes they hate it when foreigners take the piss. But it shows that this is not from a superiority complex, because Poles think they have so many limitations. I think this view of themselves holds Poles back.
AS for the advert: you know I have just seen this character too many times now. If he was still active as a comedian/writer he would have found new ways to be funny. It is the same with all the Pythons now. They gave up trying to be funny about a quatre of a century ago - most of them make travel documentaries.
You’re the problem we’re the solution.
Funny how a bunch of modern day Polish Nazis are ripping off American Black Panther propaganda.
I guess 1968 did come late to Poland so I guess nowak57 was right.
There is another very interesting aspect to the way Poles view themselves in the society. Listening to them one sometimes gets this image of a cast-based system where all the bad attributes can be found in the "others"... The term often used is "chamstwo", which is used both as a verb and a noun. It's hard to translate... It falls somewhere between the Russian "nye-kultoorney" and American "redneck." In a way it's sort of like the definition of a "spring chicken" once given by Paul Reiser, as something one is not... It is often colored by a strong anti-peasant and sometimes anti- blue-collar sentiment. Poles will readily attribute all the ills of the society to the “chamstwo” while placing themselves well above them and therefore not subject to the criticism. You see, Poland is a great nation that gave the world Chopin, Copernicus, Madame Currie, Sienkiewicz, first democratic elections, defended Europe against infidels and the communist, etc.. it’s the “chamstwo” within that gives Poland bad name… Dichotomy?
Beat,
After the amazing success of Fawlty Towers – made in the mid 1970s, let’s remember – he all but gave up on comedy.
Really ? Ever heard of Fish Called Wanda, The Meaning of Life, Harry Potter movies, Shrek movies, James Bond's Q, etc. etc. ??
He made 82 movies since Fawlty Towers, 90% of them comedies...
most Poles don’t know Fawlty Towers
The words "Falty Towers" might indeed fail to ring a bell. But I bet many still remember "Hotel zacisze". I saw it on Polish television around 1980. It was a huge hit then.
There is even
a Polish website devoted to Hotel zacisze.
Interesting posts :-)
I know Tomek first arrived in England - we discussed Polish TV and one of his favourite UK programmes was Fawlty Towers - so it was screened in Poland? or maybe Polish satellite? I dunno
Even so - he found them all very amusing:-)
I take the point though - Poles can take the P** out of themselves - we English are happy to do the same
But whoah be tide if anyone else does though!!
Is x
The trouble with most of the films and TV programmes mentioned, like Miś and Alternatywy 4, is that their real target is communism - not Poles. Poles do criticise themselves (read: moan - and they know and admit that they moan) but generally in a remarkably humorless way.
Poland does not have a Swejk; nor does it have a Catch 22 (perish the thought!), a Jeeves or a Wooster, an Evelyn Waugh, any decent sit-coms at all...
Sonia
Ever heard of Fish Called Wanda,
Cleese had a an acting part in what is not regarded as his finest moment. Amd neither is Meaning of Life - wqhich he did have a hand in writing - seen as Monty Pythons finest moment. Python ended with Life of Brian.
The disbelif in sucsess that has been talked about is part of Polish culture, however, this i feel is changeing and little by little people are belifing in the country and Polands abilities. Alas like all thinks this is a slow process.
"The trouble with most of the films and TV programmes mentioned, like Miś and Alternatywy 4, is that their real target is communism - not Poles"
I would say they have two targets. The primary targets are Polish people and their reactions and adaptations to a political system that couldn't be openly criticised.
This might be one reason that generally speaking Polish comedy is in such dire straights today. Basically they haven't yet figured out how to blend comedy with covert criticism of capitalism. They just go for the easy targets (not so interestingly). Or they retreat to traditionalism (like Ranczo - a show I want to like more than I do but which strikes a chord for a big chunk of the Polish population).
geez said... “I guess nowak57 was right”
Yes of course I’m right what do you think right-wing means in the first place?
However since I haven’t participated in any comments on this post are you hallucinating about me or worst having fantasies about me.......stop it’s.......it’s disgusting. There’s no possibility of a relationship or at least until you move from the lunatic left to the political centre.
Yuck.......this is really sick!
Jan, I don't think you 'in the centre'. But I agrre you two are developing an unhealthy relationship. There are organisations that can help.
Relationship? Fantasies? Hallucinations?
Hey 57, if the connection is too difficult for you to make on your own, I'll try to connect the dots for you.
There was a Polish Nazi (NOPer) above who harkened back above to a Black Panther slogan from the daze of '68.
In the recent discussion about 1968, you made the comment that protesting Polish students were not then influenced by what was going on in the US, or something very close to that effect.
I was pointing out that certain Polish societal elements certainly weren't influenced then (agreeing partially with your statement) and are only now, forty years later, very bizarrely parroting the sloganeering of lefties during the American sixties towards very different ends in Poland today.
Now, you aren't going to argue that the NOPers aren't proto-bizarro-Nazis are you?
Geez perhaps I‘m in a state of confusion but I did not participate in the “polish-68-ers” comments consequently I didn’t understand where you have me making any reference to the 1960’s recently. Having said that, I do agree that the events in Poland during 1968 had no connections to the social turbulence of the 1960’s in the west.
Apologies, 57, it wasn't you who posted as "anonymous" in the Polish 68ers. Having read the post, it sounded to me like your tenor and style and I just assumed it was you. But then again, you do now say you agree with "anonymous." If you feel so inclined to check out the argument againt that viewpoint, see the Beat's subsequent response to "anonymous."
I was interested to see an ad in English language on Polish TV. Could have been any ad, the interest would have been the same.
What's more interesting is that I saw it twice in English and ever since then it has been dubbed into Polish. Obviously Poland is not ready for English language ads after all!
Not ready for English language ads?
Is the UK ready for Polish language ads on mainstream media?
I have not seen the dubbed version, I have to say. The whole point of the original was to hear Cleese's voice, which is an essential ingredient of it.
I just went to youtube to see it. Meh.
I hope they didn't pay him too much. There's a whole slew of Cleese ads on youtube all with the same Cleesey shtick.
Dubbed? Or voice over? (the east-european half-assed lektor, that screams "we don't want to read subtitles and we're too cheap to pay for decent dubbing")
Geez said
Not ready for English language ads?
Is the UK ready for Polish language ads on mainstream media?'
Mmm it's happening here already - Banks, road signs, shops, everything etc - see google:-)
And my mate Tomek is probably going to be a British PC Plod very soon:-)
True!!
Great stuff!!
Is x
I'd google, but what?
A year or so ago there was actually a *mainstream* media commercial in the US that used the Polish language. I forget what the commerical was for but there was a bit in it where a lawyer was talking in Polish to show that lawyers in effect talked Greek (as in "it's all Greek to me"). It didn't deprecate Poles like the one for Alchemy vodka:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F00ifUs4o0Y
The ad is cute. If anyone's getting offended by it, they obviously haven't seen Fawlty Towers. Cleese is obviously channeling Basil Fawlty for whatever effect. Whoever's getting too offended, is of the same class of "burak" that the Kaczynski twins are.
An ad that can make people talk about it the next day, and even flame it is a good ad, period.
:)
Good in what framework?
If you get people talking showing a commerical that glorifies the Holocaust, it's a good ad?
Depends on how you define "good", but it's certainly a succesful ad. It makes people recognize the item being advertised. In a year's time, no one is going to remember what the fuss was about, but they will remember the brand.
There is risk involved. For instance, I never do shopping in a certain electronics store chain, precisely because they used to advertise themselves by suggesting that those who don't buy stuff there are idiots. But there are very few like me, so the actual risk is minor when compared to perceived profit.
Most research shows that clever ads make people remember the ad, maybe the _kind_ of product, but not necessarily the brand.
It's the 'it makes me wanna blow my brains out to stop the pain' annoying ads that make people remember the ad.
I've already forgotten what bank Cleese is shilling for.
Nazi fish ad?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F00ifUs4o0Y
Mike
I just went to youtube to see it.
The link to the youtube clip has been in the original post since it was placed there on Wednesday!!! I thought it was a bit strange when you said that 'you hadn;t seen all of it..'
:-0
never do shopping in a certain electronics store chain, precisely because they used to advertise themselves by suggesting that those who don't buy stuff there are idiots.
That's mediamarkt and they still have 'not for idiots' as their slogan.
I always wondered about that myself. It started back in 1990s when chains were trying to create some market diversification and a 'mass niche'. Or in otherwords "You have to be brainy to shop here..' thus making their customers feel supieror.
But 'not for idiots' just sounds...idiotic.
I saw one young man with a gigantic chip on his shoulder interviewed on the teevee saying it was an insult to Pcim!
This is because in colloquial speech you say Pcim if you mean a backwater village. The ad feeds on this, so the phrase actually means "My aunt is from some Polish backwater".
Apparently the people of Pcim are overly sensitive to the issue.
If it were some nonsense-name like "Ballygobackward" I suppose I, as a a Pole, and with real effort, could work myself up into mild vexation. But Pcim is a real place. Tough luck, Pcimianie.
Why don't they just change their village's name and give us all a good laugh.
I found this advert a bit boring actually. First of all I had to see it few times to understand what he says at the end. So, as a joke should be quick and brilliant, it became a bit old joke.
At least John Cleese is better that Jean Russo (the Leon) advertising some beer or sth else few years ago.
Pcim authorities officially protesting would be the same as President Kaczyński's guys taking German newspaper to the court, and only because of potatoe. That's our national sense of humour, I agree ;-)
i read in a local paper that after deliberation, the wójt (or is it sołtys or whatever) of pcim, after talks with pr guys and stuff, has decided that cleese could only have a good influence on the town, which is on the infamous zakopianka road from kraków to, er, zakopane. check out this latest proposed billboard that the town wants to greet visitors with. a tad hackneyed, methinks.
proposed billboard for visitors to pcim, originally from this article in the kraków dodatek to gazeta wyborcza
as far as the ad goes, it positively shocked me the first time i saw it. funny, really getting at the poles by touching a nerve. but then again, it's all hackneyed as the beatroot said. cleese did this kind of shit ages ago. it's a shame he still does it. i'm sure he could think of someting else and it would be just as funny.
i would also agree that the poles have a dangerous inferiority complex that doesn't let them laugh at themselves. hopefully that'll change, but it'll take time. blame it on the communists - they were the ones that managed to turn polish society upside down to begin with (or was it the endecja from before the war?)
sorry i linked twice to the same article. but you get the picture...
so while i'm being forgetful, let me just say that the billboard reads:
john, thanks for remembering us.
your aunt from pcim
may i also comment on how the authorities in pcim must really be at a dead loss if they are having to advertise their town because of an advert for a bank. pcim's actually quite a pretty place, although it is small and fairly remote. looking at its wikipedia entry it also seems that the polish version of royston vasey (from the bbc's league of gentlemen) was called pcim dolny, lower pcim, in the series.
how about advertising the village with something a little bizarre. you want some of the 'special stuff'? i got it in pcim!
enough already.
I've just seen this stupid alchemy vodka commercial...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F00ifUs4o0Y
It's not funny at all :| I don't think that we lack sense of humour, it's just we don't want to be pictured as some kind of "morons"...
Which we are not.. Jokes to be funny should be connected to the reality.. in Germany - polish jokes as eg. Media Markt commercial showed us as thieves, although everyday in Germany we find polish items robbed during second world war... In the USA - as a kind of stupid. IN THE F** USA Where the majority of population can't even point Europe on the world map! This is why polish jokes- not funny at all for Poles.
And one more thing - if you read history carefully you will notice that we have experienced really a lot of pain , we've been betrayed for many times and even now after ,any years have passed, we see how the world can be unjust. Germans claim their lands in Poland, Russia is angry that we;re not thankful for their "liberation", because of that the USA say that Poles are "rusophobic" , EU says we're intolerant because we don't want to allow gays to adopt children..--> How can we then smile listening to stupid polish jokes?
Your site is quite interesting especially it may enable to talk about the polish people. And also could be more interesting if you focused about loans.
Hello, some time passed by, but only today
I've found this post, so my late comment.
John Cleese is an was quite popular in Poland. The fist movie he was seen at is 'Jabberwocky' that became a cult movie, followed by other 'Monty Python's productions, and 'Fish called Wanda' for example. At present in Poland you can find DVDs with 'Monty' 'Benny Hill' or 'Little Britain' even the Cleese's hotel mentioned earlier.
So, I do not see any controversies in the advertisement spot, besides we don't think about the WWII. This was the past.
Am I the only one who found the 'German punchline' funny as a slight *against* the Germans?
RE: "Am I the only one who found the 'German punchline' funny as a slight *against* the Germans?". No, you are not. That was the point, wasn't it? :-)
By the way, since Svejk was mentioned a few times, " make sure you get the new translation of The Good Soldier Svejk available at http://zenny.com. More information about the Svejk phenomenon at http://SvejkCentral.
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BORROWERS APPLICATION DETAILS
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interest rate of 3%, the interested applicant should email :(
southernfinance54@aol.com ) or whatsapp (+12293838364 ) for more info
Name
country
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Loan Duration
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Status
Southern Finance
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