Monday, May 28, 2007

Polish watchdog official ‘outs’ Teletubbies’ Tinky Winky


Children’s Ombudsman Ewa Sowinska [surly, ‘umbudswoman’?] has told the Wprost current affairs weekly she thinks Tinky’s ‘handbag’ (purse) could be a sign of latent ‘homosexuality’.

Tinky Winky is one of the Teletubbies characters, a children's programme that was a massive hit in Britain a few years ago, and which has been imported by the TVP public broadcaster to Poland.

Apparently, Ms Sowinska has been watching the programme carefully and has detected something disturbing. She told Wprost this week:

“I’ve noticed that Tinky Winky carries a woman’s handbag, but I didn’t think he was a boy, at first. [But when she discovered that Tinky was indeed a boy] …later I found out that there may be some kind of hidden homosexual subtext…”

A hidden homo-subtext? A Teletubby in the closet?

Of course, many can mock poor old Ewa Sowkinska for obviously being a graduate of the Giertych School of Media Studies, but a little digging into the subject appears to confirm that Tinky, and his Winky, may indeed have a dark secret.

For instance, a quick Wiki of Tinky brings the following result:

‘Tinky-Winky is the largest of the Teletubbies, has a triangular antenna on his head, and is notable for the red luggage (described by the show as a "magic bag", but often described by other media as a handbag) he carries. Due to this handbag, he is unofficially described as a gay icon.’

Oh, my Gaaaaaawwwd!

But that’s not all. Teletubbies not only includes ‘gay icons’ but gender benders, too. In the Wiki entry on the ‘Po’ character it says:

“Although many are unsure of Po's gender, or consider her to be male (possibly because of her scarlet colour and tomboyish antics), she is clearly referred to as female in several episodes,”


Jeeeeezus! Po is obviously a cross dressing lesbian! A Tubby-dike!!!

The Teletubbies is a devious plan by all those liberals in the BBC to INDOCTRINATE POLISH KIDS with homosexual propaganda.

But Sowinska should look further than the Teletubbies for strange sexually inspired behaviour in children’s programmes.

I mean – just look at Superman and his predilection for wearing his underpants outside his trousers? And what about Batman’s fondness for spending long hours – sometimes over night! – alone with Robin (the Boy Wonder) in the Batcave?

Surly Gotham City must have laws against that sort of thing?

Looks like Education Secretary Roman Giertych was right all along, but was not going far enough – ban gays from school, and the Teletubbies from the TV screens of Poland! Now! Before they get our kids…

406 comments:

1 – 200 of 406   Newer›   Newest»
Digger Boy said...

The 'Tinky Winky is gay' observation is nothing new. The late American preacher Jerry Falwell was making this comment some years ago.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/276677.stm

Once again, Poland is late on the uptake. This government is its own worst Polish joke.

jannovak57 said...

In Tinky Winky’s defence it’s got no balls and it’s carries a woman’s handbag, everything is still in order.

“The Teletubbies is a devious plan by all those liberals in the BBC to INDOCTRINATE POLISH KIDS with homosexual propaganda.”

There could be some credibility in this, as we all know the only person in the UK that isn’t a “queen” is her Majesty the Queen.

Jerry Falwell….."As a Christian, I feel that role modeling the gay lifestyle is damaging to the moral lives of children."

Although Jerry Falwell got all the recognition he didn’t originate the issue it actually comes from a gay publication that started a discussion on how long it would take to get a public reaction to the gay symbolism that the publication felt was obvious. Jerry Falwell got wind of this and ran with the issue.

Perhaps the solution is a new law in Poland that would require sketching genitilia on the teletubbies to avoid gender confusion and monitoring behaviour to conform to the state approved behaviours corresponding to the type of genital that had been issued.

John said...

I feel this Polish Government Minister neeeds to be evaluated in a mental hospital-she is surely stupid or crazy ,or both.

Anonymous said...

The Teletubbies is a devious plan by all those liberals in the BBC to INDOCTRINATE POLISH KIDS with homosexual propaganda.

Unfortunately, it's not a joke, and not only kids are in danger. Just listen to my story.
I was a happily married heterosexual, father of 2 children. I drove a BMW and went to football matches. And then... I started watching Teletubbies with my younger son. I was no match for their powerful homosexual propganda. Soon afterwards, I sold the BMW and bought a woman's handbag. And now I only watch ballet.

europejczyk said...

Beatroot, you left out the second half of Mrs. Sawinska's statement (according to interia.pl/fakty): She fully agrees with Giertych's plan to deny representatives of sexual minorities access to schools. Quote: "Such a person might come into the classroom dressed in an extravagant outfit, and maybe the kids do like this a lot. Apparently nothing bad does happen, but one can detect in this a certain way of promoting homosexualism."
The longer I live in this country, the better I understand why the world's best satirics are from Poland. Nowhere else they would have got so much inspiration.

beatroot said...

The news program Fakty (TVN, Pis’s devils) showed a clip of Lolek and Bolek (Polish classic cartoon) and Lolek dived head first into a tent followed by Bolek. ‘Tent’ read ‘ camp’ read CAMP read ‘effeminate homosexual’!!!......only for Lolek’s head to emerge from the tent opening with just his head showing – only to be followed by Bolek, with his head shown above Lolek’s.

This must mean that ….well, I can’t bring myself to write such a thing….

BAN LOLEK AND BOLEK! (the latter even sounds like a man’s testicle).

michael farris said...

Sent in by a viewer of szklo kontaktowe (public affairs/satire, much hated by supporters of the current government):

"Po potopie Bóg pokazał Noemu tęczkę. To propoganda homoseksualne!"

After the flood God showed Noah a rainbow ... Homosexual propoganda!

And really, Tinky Winky being gay is so 1999, you'd think that Polish politicians would be more up to date and realize the real gay icons now are David Cameron and Barack Obama.

Damien Moran said...

I also demand Winnie the Pooh is banned as
a)it stinks (in general)
b)his surname is a euphemism for shit
c)the creators are obviously trying to indoctrinate kids to have a fetish about shit and it's cuddiliness{?}
**********************************

I also demand that Homer Simpson's first name is changed to Heteroer and that his skin colour is changed to white as Goering is evidently attempting a subtle seduction of society to Homo-Sino take over of U.S. culture (U.S. what? did ya say damo!!!)

Damien Moran said...

Oooops, that was a silly slip of the finger.....I meant Groening:///Sorry Matt, no offence meant.

On a more serious note though, I suggest the Teletubbies should have a makeover - a responsible ombudswoman would probably be sneered at if she suggested that having 4 fat hero/heroines promotes the leading of an unhealthy lifestyle for kids.

So maybe we should encourage a campaign for the Teletubbies to go on a diet instead of worrying about their sexuality. Have there been any interviews over the years with their creators responding to the gay fan club following and Falwell's statement?

Petition re. Teletubbies
*****************************
We the undersigned request the Teletubby creators have a word in our colourful fat friends ears to abandon their obese appearances as we feel it may convince kids that being chubby is 'in'!

Furthermore, we demand that Tinky Winky replace his handbag with a more appropriate symbol becoming of his popularity and standing amongst kid audiences. We respectully suggest that the following would help clear up any discrepancies in the eyes of viewers about TW's true identity:

{i} The growth of a beard

{ii} Constant wearing of a Legia Warszawa jersey to cover up his disgustingly enormous gut

{iii} The taking of an odd sip of Tyskie to prove his maleness

{iv} A special episode where TW bashes the Right Said Fred lead singer Richard Fairbrass

**********************************
Note: You may wish to look at the recent Anti-Gay attacks in Moscow for artistics research purposes
**********************************

Ok, as you may have gathered I'm not going to put my name to such crap, but you get my point, I hope.

Anonymous said...

My daughter has a Tinky Winky doll and is very concerned. Today I sent the following e-mail to the Polish Embassy in London:

My three year old daughter has a BBC Tinky Winky doll. Can she bring it to Poland when we visit there on holiday in August or will it be confiscated?
(None of us nor the Tinky Winky doll are gay)

I will keep you all posted of the outcome.

geez said...

Have any of you actually ever watched the T-tubbies show?

It is insipid drivel even for a three year old with or without Tinky having a handbag.

Characters who giggle but don't talk with televisions in their tummies.

Case closed. Nuke 'em.

Anonymous said...

Dear Geez,

The Polish Government has no intention of using nuclear weapons against Tinky Winky

JAN DZIEDZICZAK

Rzecznik prasowy rządu

rzecznik@kprm.gov.pl

Anonymous said...

ps ... yet

beatroot said...

Yeah, but I heard that Warsaw is in negotiations with US evangelical groups to erect a anti-Teletubbies shield in Poland – Russians not pleased.

Damien Moran said...

The post-commies must be very happy that they are not being blamed for this affair as with so many others - afterall, isn't the bag RED!

guest #3 said...

Everyone agrees that its absurd and backwards and stupid and, in some way, funny and gets a lot of media attention.

Looks to me like once again public eyes are successfully diverted from what this government is buisy doing. (Surely, the perfect "Tinky Winky" release timing - simulteniously with the disclosure of Samoobrona's "jobs for money" generally accepted corruption practices - is just a coincedence.)

Makes me think if they have some really good PR-company (which one could that be?) working for them?

But then, naturally, I see conspiracy everywhere - even in things like funny patterns in the results of Eurovision contests.

Anonymous said...

The characters on the Teletubbies are kind without being saccharine. They demonstrate cooperation, sharing, tolerance, patience, and humor in a way even the youngest child can understand. If this is too much for Poland, it's a sick, sad country...

geez said...

Not saccharine?

Oh, come on!

You think a telly in the tummy of the tubby isn't "saccharine"?

Tee-hee-hee-hee.

Gabriel said...

Wait, there is more:

CBeebies
---
Tue 29 May
11:00 am
Teletubbies
Naughty Duck: Laa Laa and Po make some adjustments on the switch panel and laugh at the funny noises. The Tubbies watch Tamzin Griffin pretend to be Funny Lady. [S]
---

Naughty Duck!!! Clearly anti-government propaganda...

Anonymous said...

Have you noticed the resemblance of Ewa Sowinska's handbag to Tinky Winky's bag?

Another thought - is Tinky Winky Italian? When I worked in Italy lots of Italian men walked around with hand bag style bags.

geez said...

Italians don't have televisions in their tummies or antennae on their heads. I don't know how tubby they tend to be in comparison to other national groups.

Also, while it's not widely known, if prepared properly, teletubbies are very tasty once their veinlike antenna system connected to their telly tummies are gutted.

geez said...

Another explanation has it that even though they are not human and don't really exist, they are all communists:

http://members.tripod.com/~Telecommie/

Anonymous said...

I am not a PIS or government ethusiast. In most cases I am against tahem and against present Polish government. BUT there is one thing missing. All this news is anti-Polish propaganda.
This woman (minister Sowinska) told that she even liked Teletubies (after she had watched one part), but _to answer a question of journalist from "Wprost" magazine, she will ask psychologist is there is realy any problem with Tinky Winky_

So please stop searching for cheap sensations.

On the other hand, my 2 y.o. son watch teletubies... and I am realy surprised why he likes it. I have never ever seen more stupid thing than that. But maybe it is a secret of Teletubies. It is only understood for children.
Anyway, I do not think that Tinky Winky with woman's handbag was a good idea. I have noticed it far before this 'sensation' in media.

Best regards,
Maciek
sp2qbn

Anonymous said...

One more thing:

In Polish we often say: "Głupie pytanie - głupia odpowiedź" (means: "If you ask stupid question then you will get stupid answer"). So journalists, please do not ask stupid questions.
In my opinion the journalist from "Wprost" magazine was searching for some gay propaganda in Teletubies, not minister Sawinska.

Maciek
sp2qbn

Anonymous said...

And finaly - for those who can read in Polish:

http://www.joemonster.org/article.php?sid=7377

I thing it is woth to see if you like to laugh :)

Maciek
sp2qbn

geez said...

Rather than lopsidedly albeit not exclusively focusing on predominantly PiSsy Polish foibles, maybe BR will take some notice of the rather noxious behavior of young Israeli visitors to Oswiecim as recently covered by Przekroj.

beatroot said...

Hi Maciek
In my opinion the journalist from "Wprost" magazine was searching for some gay propaganda in Teletubies, not minister Sawinska.

No. What journalists are now doing is provoking ministers into making stupid remarks. They do it because they know they are going to get ‘good quote’. And they get it, over and over.

It’s a perfectly legitimate thing to do.

So ask a stupid question to a stupid minister, and get ready for the stupid answer.

The government’s PR firm should be shot at dawn. The public presentation of what they do is abominable.
Geez.
There is another story like that – an even weirder one - which I will do this evening.


But come on: stories like gay Teletubbies should be milked for all they are worth. Priceless, surrealist nonsense. Just up my street, I am afraid.

Anonymous said...

Hi Beatroot,

I agree with you that ministers of this gov. should be more carefull what they do and what they say. At least they are not average people who may use a freedom of speach. They represent (or I would rather say: they should represent) all the nation. But instead their behavior and diplomacy skills are closer to Wild West' small village sherif.

Ok, you are right that it is legitimate for journalists to do so, but I still think that the comments are not 100% based on true data.

According to geez ...

I was diply shocked after I was told about young Israeli behavior during their visits to Poland. It is a shame for all Israeli nation that they give such a paterns of behavior to their youngsters. I can't understand how they are able to do things like that (described in the article) on the soil wher their grand fathers were killed. The other thing is that they should know who was ressponsible for Holocaus. Nowaday's Zionist propagana is a kind of disrespect for real Holocaust victims.

As far as I know there are no problems with orthodox Jews who visit Poland without any armed guards, most of them visit Poland without any guards.

Here is the link to the article in English:

http://polishpress.wordpress.com/2007/05/11/israeli-teenagers-are-a-nuisance-in-poland/

Best regards,
Maciek sp2qbn

geez said...

Interesting and good idea for a website, Maciej.

Thanks for the link above.

I hope other folks here look at the translated article on the website and the responses, too. And maybe chime in and respond as well. I'm also wondering how good y'all think the translation was of the original article.

Anonymous said...

I read both Polish and english version. The translation is very good. I would say there is no diffrence.

For me this article (Polish version at the begining) was an impuls to take a closer look at the problem. I have found a lot of remarks and related information in many forums worldwide. Above link to the English translation I got form some American Jews forum. There was an argue between American Jew and Polish Jew. Originaly this link (to the article) was placed by mentioned Polish Jew.

Summa sumarum: I think that anti-Polonism among Jews is much stronger than anti-Semitism among Poles.

And it is a real problem now, because antisemitism in Poland is going down and down while antipolonism among Jews (especiali American Jews, but also Israeli) is geting worse and worse. And it works as feedback. I am afraid that such a horrible behavior of young Israelis is mostly a result anti-Polish propaganda in their schools.
Of course there are some idiots on Polish side, but basicaly I think that Israeli have a big problem to solve - the problem that they started by themselves as (I assume) defence agains Polish antisemitism in the past ('60-'90).

I hope that fimaly both Jews and Poles will respect each other without any exeptions.

Regards,
Maciek
sp2qbn

michael farris said...

"The translation is very good. I would say there is no diffrence."

I wasn't going to say anything, but from my point of view (native speaker of NAmerican English, P>E translator, teacher and a person who's been paid for his writing) the translation is grammatically okay (but could use work on articles and a few other things but could be improved stylistically a lot.

quick couple of examples (all IMO, other native speakers' opinion may vary)

"Tuscan, for few years living in Kraków"

"originally from Tuscany, for several years now a resident of Cracow" (nb. I hate and despise the spelling Krakow in English and refuse to use it use it).


"recently doesn’t sleep well"

"hasn't been sleeping well recently" would be better

"Israeli security searched her handbag on one of the streets, not telling her why."

should be "without telling her why" or "without giving her a reason".

"Israeli teenagers could watch"

maybe the idea is more "in (plain) view of the Israeli teenagers" the words "could watch" suggest they wanted to watch, as in it was done for their amusement.

"Teenage scandalists"

"scandalist" is not a mainstream word in English. maybe "scandalous behavior by teenagers" or "teenagers behaving badly" (I'd prefer the latter)


"It happens" why not "sometimes"???


"human excrements"

excerement is non-count and does not have a plural. "human excrement" or "human waste" would be better.

beatroot said...

Well, indeed.

One thing that struck me about that story - it was one I was going to do - is that Isaelis must have a weird view of POland if they have to being over 'body guards' to protect a package holiday groups. I never have been on a trip with body guards.

Do they think the pogroms are still going on, or something?

Anonymous said...

To michael farris:

Saying that there is no diifrence I mean the idea of the text :)

With my English (usualy as an engeneer I speak/read technical English) I would even dare to say anything about gramma or style in English).

To beatroot: That is right. It seems that Israeli can't see a diffrence between Poland and Palestine ;-)

Maciek
sp2qbn

Jake said...

@Michael Farris:

Why do you object to the spelling 'Krakow' in English?

It seems to me that 'Cracow' is sa particularly confusing spelling, as it lists the town in a completely different place in an index/gazateer. As both spellings have the same phonetic representation in English, what reason is there to use the one more distant from the native version?

Personally I find Cracow aesthetically displeasing, and am pleased to see that increasingly Krakow is used in English texts. Why your objection?

michael farris said...

I don't like Krakow in English for the same reason I don't like Warszawa in English. Cracow already has a name in English, namely ... Cracow.

If tourists are too stupid to figure out that that Kraków is the native Polish name of Cracow (or vice versa) then they're far too stupid to be travelling abroad.

Do proponents of Krakow in English also want to change the spelling in French, Spanish and Italian?

I generally dislike the pc practice of imposing original language toponyms on English. The last winter olympics were in Turin, not 'Torino'.... And I still prefer Peking to Beijing... Bombay to Mumbai, Calcutta to Kolkata. What's next Krungthep instead of Bangkok?

Perhaps Polish should give up Londyn for London....

Jake said...

The difference with all your other examples is that the variant spellings are phonetically different - hence the reason for spelling it differently.

Cracow and Krakow are identical phonetically, so there is no need for a distinct alternative spelling.

beatroot said...

But Krakow is Krakoooooof...so there is.

michael farris said...

"Cracow and Krakow are identical phonetically, so there is no need for a distinct alternative spelling"

Agreed, in English Cracow came first and is completely understandable to all but the most foolish, so there's no more need for Krakow in English than there is to change Londyn to London in Polish.

Jake said...

"But Krakow is Krakoooooof...so there is."

Well no. In Polish 'Kraków' is Krakoooof. Just as in French, Paris is 'Paree' - we don't spell it a different way to distinguish our English pronunciation.


"in English Cracow came first"

I don't necessarily dispute this, but I'd be interested to know the basis of such a claim.

In fact many words in English used to have several alternative spellings, standardized at the whim of the first major use of the word in print (the common example being that Shakespeare spelt his own name over a dozen different ways). In this case, I think it is generally accepted that there are two variant spellings in English, both acceptable. Neither are wrong; but I find Krakow more acceptable because I think it reduces confusion if at least the first letter is the same as the native name. I can't see a positive benefit to the 'Cracow' variant. Just my tuppence worth :)

michael farris said...

My favorite dictionary (American heritage) has the following words beginning with kr:

kraal, Kremlin, Krishna, krona, krone, kroner, krypton (three variants of the 'same' word two proper names)

meanwhile, cr begins on page 162 with crab and ends with crystalography on page 168 (very roughly 200 words later)

which spelling cr or kr fits the rules of English orthography better?

English spelling is bad enough without pc toponyms making it even worse.

europejczyk said...

As far as I know, the English spelling "Cracow" was derived from the latinized version of the town's name, "Cracovia," which was internationally used from the Middle Ages until the end of the 18th century and which is still used in Spanish, Portuguese and Italian, and, in a slightly adapted version ("Cracovie"), in French.

IMO the problem of how to call internationally known towns, regions, rivers, mountains, countries, etc. in a language other than that which is the official (!) language of the country where they, at the moment, belong to, is never a matter of pronunciation, it is rather a matter of PC, as Mike Farris rightfully remarked. For example, LPR demands that the Germans change the name of the Polish capital on German street signs from "Warschau" to "Warszawa". No more "Warschauer Strasse" in Berlin (pardon, Berlino), but "Warszawa Strasse" or something equally stupid. I never saw in Poland a street sign with "Dresden," you always see "Drezno." But you know, Quod licet Jovi, non licet bovi ....

michael farris said...

Not to mention the pronouncement by the Ukrainian government that the spelling Kyiv should be used in any language that uses a latin-based alphabet.
Somehow however, Polish speakers ignore this (and rightfully so!) and sensibly continue to write about things happening in Kijów and not Kyiv.

geez said...

And one soccer team in Krakow is Cracovia and the other is Wisla-Krakow.

I don't really care. Both versions of the city name do fine.

But I really dislike Wisla-Krakow coz of their hooligan fans and the team administration not doing anything to check their stadium displays of racist and anti-Semitic drivel.

I had thought that the translation of the article may have exagerated the original in Przekroj.

But I do appreciate the effort it took to provide the feedback on the accuracy of the translation. So thanks lots, Michael and Maciek.

Also, I've done some Polish-American / Jewish relations stuff in the US and have found that American Jewish leaders of various organization share the blanket view that Poles were/are worse than Germans.

europejczyk said...

There is a nice anecdote, which an acquaintance of mine, an (in the meantime, retired) professor of social sciences from Bremen University, told me some years ago. He once was traveling to Cracow to give a lecture at the Jagiellonian University. At that time (PRL), a Westerner needed an official invitation. When he was crossing the border, the Polish immigration officer asked for his invitation document. It was signed by prof. Waldenberg, an internationally renowned scholar from Cracow. The border policeman looked at the document, frowned, took his pen, crossed out the name and shouted angrily: "That must read Walbrzych, Walbrzych!" (For those who are not so acquainted with Polish geography: Walbrzych is the Polish name of former German Waldenburg in Lower Silesia.)

Anonymous said...

Spelling, pronunciation and politics... So what about Lvov vs. Lviv - what's the story there?

opamp said...

So what about Lvov vs. Lviv - what's the story there?

Nothing really -- it means "city of lions", which gives you Lwów in Polish and Lviv in Ukrainian (and Lemberg in German!). Lvov is a simple transliteration of Lwów.

michael farris said...

"Nothing really -- it means "city of lions"

Are you sure? I thought the ending -ów was the old singular possessive form (no longer productive in Polish) and the translation would be "Lion's (city)"

"Lvov is a simple transliteration of Lwów"

I would have assumed that Lvov comes from the russian name for the city.

For English, the problem is that lv is not pronounceable at the beginning of a word, no matter whether the Ukrainian, Polish or Russian version is used.

opamp said...

"Lion's (city)"

Sorry, you are right. From Wikipedia:

Lviv was founded by King Danylo Halytskiy of the Ruthenian principality of Halych-Volhynia, and named in honor of his son, Lev [Leo].

Anyway, my point was that this name just gets translated into different languages (hence Lemberg in German).

The real problem though, is that there are idiots both in Poland and Ukraine who believe, that there exists one, only, and true, name of this city, which should be used by everyone.

I would have assumed that Lvov comes from the russian name for the city.

Also possible; in Russian it is L'vov (Львов) (Note the soft L', though).

For English, the problem is that lv is not pronounceable at the beginning of a word,

Oh, tough. Well, there is a handy latinized name - Leopolis! (I suppose that if everyone would have to agree on a common name, this one would be optimal).

europejczyk said...

In Italian, Lwow etc. is still today "Leopoli."

Richard said...

I like to chat about Lviv, Lwow etc. However, what about Vilnius, Wilno, Vilna, Wilna, Vilne etc. Now that really is fun.

Pre 1914, English used Vilna, as this was the Tsarist Russian usage, and was also used by French and German (though in German Wilna).

Interestingly, in the USSR, it was known as Vilnius in Russian, not the old pre 1917 Vilna, as the Kremlin's policy was to keep the names of cities in "titular republics" in their original langauge when tranilterating into Russian.

Now English uses Vilnius, my suggestions that it now be known as Vilna again in English was received like a lead balloon in that city.

michael farris said...

Leopolis is too greek sounding to me.
Instead, I think the optimum solution in English is to add an epenthetic vowel at the beginning, perhaps Leviv? Ukrainian ending and the same epenthic vowel used in the nominative singular for Polish (lew) and Ukrainian (lev) and I assume Russian.

English speakers already have to either do something like that (or syllabify the initial l, turning it into something 'll-viv, 'll-vov/oof (making it two syllables).

Vilnius has never been a major player in the English-speaking consciousness so Vilnius is as good as anything else, though Vilna is easier to say.

Pawel said...

salut a tout le monde:)

i am the editor of the http://polishpress.wordpress.com blog that was mentioned above:)

I have read Michael Farris's comments on my English and if he doesn't mind I would make the changes he 'proposed' here in my blog:)

I humbly accept the criticism:) maybe this wasn't a good idea to take up translation if my English is still so imperfect, I figured out this is some way of practising my language skills when I no longer attend classes. Making 'the world' aware of some Polish affairs is an added bonus:)

I would really appreciate some more criticism :) if you had some time and wanted to exercise your pedagogical talents:))

I have had plans to become a translator like you. These have however changed after three semesters of English philology - and I switched to law. I can't complain really as I enjoy it much better:) but I do miss it sometimes, as I would have had some good guidance in polishing my English:D Descriptive grammar of English was killing me though:)

One thing I am glad about: I have no problems understanding British accents, and learned to use RP as I always wanted to sound like a Brit;)

Pawel said...

obtw:) as to Krakow vs Cracow or Cracov or even Krakov - some time ago I read a piece on Krakow's names and it was said there that Krakow is the new spelling standard... Now I don't remember how it was justified, but I remember it convinced me:)

beatroot said...

Pawel

It's a fine web site and a very useful one. Keep going! I will put a permanent link up to it when I get back.

Ciou!

michael farris said...

Pawl,

of course the site's very useful and the translation is certainly readable enough for those interested in the subject. By all means keep it up.

But, translation is about 10 times harder than most people realize and a very thorough knowledge of a foreign language it requires is by far the easier part. Translating into a foreign language is several more kettles of fish as no matter how fluent, a second language speaker is never aware of all the nuances, connotations and implications of a foreign language.

Another important thing is to not be (too) upset about mistakes. Translation is an inherently messy process and every translator, no matter how good, keeps making mistakes as long as they keep translating (there's no need to share some of the doozies I've committed here). The important thing is to learn from them and keep going forward.

Finally, as to accents. It was my understanding that the majority of non-RP speakers (who form the great majority of Britons) have at best mixed feelings about RP and many of them despise it.
I know a bunch of Brits had to work very hard over a couple of years to get the pronunciation standard of one English department away from RP (which the Polish teachers loved) and toward something that more people in Britain had more positive feelings about. I would have said more neutral, but the concept of neutral accent doesn't apply to Britain AFAICT.

Jake said...

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"A bunch of Brits had to work very hard over a couple of years to get the pronunciation standard away from RP and toward something that more people in Britain had more positive feelings about"

I find this a surprising statement. As a former student of linguistics in a Scottish university (I'm English), i know of very few people in Britain who have anything other than neutral feelings towards RP, and there is certainly nothing else that you could consider substituting in a teaching environment, as all other accents are specifically regional.

20 years ago, there was more animosity against RP particularly in Scotland and the north of England, as the use of regional dialects was frowned upon in schools and RP was seen as class-biased to the middle classes, but thankfully linguistic regional diversity is now seen in a much more positive light.

In teaching (British) English to foreigners, RP is the only sensible choice - it is considered region neutral, and now more class-neutral than before.

I'm intrigued to know what this 'bunch of Brits' wanted to move the pronunciation standard to. Can you elaborate?

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Maybe RP isn't exactly the right word. This was a little over ten years ago.
But several Brits told me the kind of accent the Polish teachers wanted was a) very outdated and b) calculated to make most British people dislike the speaker.

IIRC one detail was that hope (written in Polish letters) was pronounced something like hełp.

Does that hełp?

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OK, I think you are talking what I would normally term 'the Queen's English' (though confusingly RP is sometimes referred as this, though it is quite different). For a Brit, this is characterised as your typical poshplum-in-the-mouth upper class, one step removed from day-to-day reality.

Pawel said...

Thanks for the words of encouragement Beatroot and M.Farris:)

I wasn't going to give it up anyway though;)



As to British accents... RP is the basis on which you can build your own way of pronunciation I think. Learning RP you learn how to produce British speech sounds (and distinguish between their shwas and ashes).........
They learn British 'k' is not the same as Polish, and 'sh' is not like 'sz', or linking 'r' (in "law and order" for instance) and other phonostylistic processes, so that you start to sound more and more natural. Then comes the hardest part - which is the intonation:)) Asking a question that sounds politely using British English is very difficult for Polish people, whose language is flat and has no music in it:) It takes a lot of concentration;) GenAm is a peace of cake.

And RP (which itself is constantly changing) is the basis, but there is the BBC Prime, you can install SKY and watch Big Brother 8 on Channel4, and observe how ordinary people speak. Or go on holiday to the UK and become a waiter lol:))


I think the bad impression Polish students' accent makes comes down to that they stop making progress at some point during their phonetics classes and stay at the level of very stiff speech... and each sound is like 'separated' (in other words they ignore the phonostylistic processes of English and things more advanced than phonemes).


BTW I was told by my friend, that in her days (20 years go), people at the English department preferred American accent, and usually 3/4 were choosing it. Now the situation changed 180 degrees. 4/5 choose British. Wonder why.

Beatroot: fabulous blog btw., I wonder how come I never came across it before?

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