Things get worse for Poland’s celebrity refugee.
As Mol languishes in jail awaiting charges of knowingly spreading HIV to numerous women since he has been in Poland as a refugee since 1999, police will be questioning him on yet another charge.
Rzeczpospolita is reporting today that Mol received one of the five apartments given, annually, by the local council to refugees last year.
Unfortunately, Simon Mol is on the board that decides which refugee gets which apartment.
Oh, dear.
Thursday, February 01, 2007
Simon Mol charged with...corruption!
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
158 comments:
"Mol received one of the five apartments given, annually, by the local council ... Simon Mol is on the board that decides which refugee gets which apartment."
Hey, it sounds like he's assimilated to Polish cultural norms just fine to me.
Mr. Farris: haha! It's sad but true.
yeah michael, your spot on.
I have to say again, I somehow find myself feeling like Im watching a lynching. Maybe everything he is accused of is true --- but per Mr Farris' remarks, this is so common as to be almost expected. So why is Mol charged and not so many others?
I dont know....even if its all true,.., which I still doubt, I hate seeing a black refugee attacked this way in the media. Everyone is enjoying it far too much.
steppx,
Get over it. Mol is a predatory criminal. It has nothing to do with his race or refugee status. He has betrayed the public trust in more ways than one. It is not racist to call a criminal a criminal.
You said "So why is Mol charged and not so many others?"
So what you're saying is that Mol should only be charged if all the others are charged first? Heh?!?
Of course, Stepx is right in the way that folk seem to get a perverse – and perverse is the right word – satisfaction out of this ugly ugly story… .
This latest bit is, of course, because the cops are going through the guy’s life with a toothbrush, trying to get as much on him as possible to take to the prosecutors. They are under lots pressure too to get the guy banged up.
As for the public reaction to this. Putting aside the rights and wrongs of it - and he remains innocent until the judge says so – this kind of story is very timely in a way. By having an outsider like Mol ‘damage’ Polish society in the way he appears to have done, makes Polish society seem, feel better…it brings people together, in a weird way. Mol is the ‘other’ that makes everyone else feel better about themselves.
Sad then that it needs a case like this to give Poles some cohesion.
The same thing can be said about a recent similar case in the UK.
This is NOT a uniquely Polish problem.
And as far as Mol assimilating to *Polish* cultural norms vis-a-vis grabbing that apartment for himself, that kinda shit happens everywhere including the US where guys and wimmen in local Housing and Urban Development offices help themselves and their friends and family to the best apartments.
So cut me a break about how this is a uniquely Polish problem or a Polish cultural norm. Dat's bigotry.
Tink you iz right, Geeeeeeez.......
"Sad then that it needs a case like this to give Poles some cohesion."
Hmmmmmm... scapegoat...
Is there any sweeter word in the English language? In Polish it's kozioł ofiarny and just as sweet.
Not sure I understand what you just said.
My point is that cases like this – when someone so obviously not Polish (in this case) is seen as a threat to (Polish) society – and that is the way the case is being presented – gives a kind of coherence to a society that lacks that ‘solidarity’.
A threat from the outside by an ‘other’ is something that media can create a consensus from that wasn’t there in the first place.
Polish society is weak and needs cases like this to draw it together.
Within this is racism, of course. Mol is not being treated as some kind of deviant individual – he is being presented as a representative of a deviant group – something African: all the crap about ‘dry sex’ etc…
HIV is seen as something that is being brought into Polish society from outside…and Mol’s case is perfect for this.
This case is being presented as (literally) a ‘virus’ of an ‘other’ culture.
And that creates an ersatz solidarity for the ‘host’ culture. It makes then feel superior in someway. We are better than ‘them’…makes ‘us’ unite against a threat from outside….
Can you tell I used to be a sociology lecturer?
:-(
I cannot agree with the view that the Mol case is fueled by "Polish racism." I don't have a Polish passport, but live in Poland since 1999, married to a WONDERFUL Polish girl. My personal experience is that Poland isn't more "racist" than other countries and that it is far less racist than e.g. the U.S. (where I have been living quite a long time and met lots of black and - forgive me - Jewish racism).
Mol has been a prominent public personality in Poland. In public, he stood for the highest human ideals, and the color of his skin (and his alleged vita as a bold fighter against corruption!) made him the darling of the "progressive" strata of society, opened him doors, hearts (and ladies' pants), and not least taxpayers' wallets. Mol cleverly used "race" as a tool to gain popularity and profit and to fight critics. Who wonders that now, when the truth comes to light, the "race" weapon fires back?
Europejczyk said: “My personal experience is that Poland isn't more "racist" than other countries and that it is far less racist than e.g. the U.S. (where I have been living quite a long time and met lots of black and - forgive me - Jewish racism)”
Europejczyk – you’re really full of crap. I don’t live in Poland but I did grow up in Poland and what I remember is a society in which even the educated used terms such as “czarnuch” and “murzyn” in reference to any blacks (or, not so whites…). I remember society where it was a norm to speak of blacks as inferior race. I remember society where African students where being beaten up and sometimes killed just for talking to Polish women. I remember my own mother wanting the assurances that my fiancee (now wife) was not by any chance anything other than white. I also remember society where Jews were referred to as “zydki” – term that has inherently pejorative meaning in Polish. You would have to travel deep into the South to find this kind of deeply seeded racial hatred in the U.S. It’s true that you still have pockets of the whites clinging to their “white pride” paranoia, but it’s limited mostly to prison populations and the rural areas in the South. It’s just not acceptable anymore. In Poland it is still a socially acceptable mentality. Obviously you know very little about either one of the cultures you chose to volunteer your poorly articulated and grammatically flawed opinion. Ignorance is not flattering.
I guess poish racists are not infecting inocent girls with AIDS deliberately like did the ANTIFASCIST OF THE YEAR 2003...
Albert wrote:
"You would have to travel deep into the South to find this kind of deeply seeded racial hatred in the U.S. It’s true that you still have pockets of the whites clinging to their “white pride” paranoia, but it’s limited mostly to prison populations and the rural areas in the South"
Well, the very recent comments by Jo Biden (a POTUS candidate) on African Americans are clearly racist, right? Is Biden a member of a prison population? Is he a white supremacist? Or is he simply speaking his mind? Who elected him to Congress, then? You are right when you say that racism is not socially acceptable in the US anymore. But do you think that 'social unacceptability' should be the sole reason for not being racist? Should it not come from within an individual? Are you not racist because you ARE genuinely not racist, or are you not racist because you want to conform to the current norm? What if the norm changes? Will you follow? Are you a tool or a human being?
Sorry to learn your Mom is a racist... As apples fall not far from the tree, you sound to me like a grammar fascist. Do you really care that much about a displaced comma? One more thing, if you have some references to your claim that blacks ‘where’ (did you mean ‘were’?) being killed in Poland for talking to Polish women I would be grateful if you could share them.
The post-mortem of Mol’s case continues… The Polish society’s weaknesses are being exposed… I have a nagging feeling that his trial and sentence will also be viewed as racist. Even if he is simply guilty as charged. Poland will not be given the benefit of the doubt. Will Poland care? I hope not.
Oh come on Albert! You have to go to the deep south in the US to find racist attitudes among whites? Do you recall the busing battles in northern cities in the 60s, 70s and even 80s? I live in a northeastern city and I can assure you that white racism is still very much alive. You might also want to talk to some black folk to see if they think it is no longer acceptable. And anti-Jewish sentiments are also prevalent. Ever hear of Mel Gibson? Do you really think that he is such an exception?
Also isn't "murzyn" more like "negro"? And doesn't "czarny" mean "black"? I always thought the derogatory term, the equivalent of the n-word, is "asfalt."
Of course, Poles can use the former terms in a derogatory context just as blacks can use the n-word to celebrate their 'lumpen-ness."
And while I realize that racism is a problem in Poland, I really don't think it's at all unique to Poland. I would even argue that it's a much bigger problem in the US in that blacks constitute 10 per cent of the population. I mean, c'mon, I know a lot of black folks who are quite angry about institutional and individual white racism in the US, and not just in the deep south.
Europejczyk
cannot agree with the view that the Mol case is fueled by "Polish racism."
I was not saying that his case was being ‘fueled’ by Polish racism. What I was referring to was Stepxx’s remark that people seemed to getting some kind of dark enjoyment from it. My point was about the societal reaction to the crime, if there has been any. That reaction is informed, I believe, by racism and that Mol is an outsider. If the guy had been a Pole then the reaction would have taken on a different character.
Beatroot,
The housing thing is, in its own way, quite funny.
It is precisely the same sort of low level corruption one finds everywhere in the world - I mean, you must have heard stories about the relatives of Lewisham/Lambeth/Wandsworth/Newcastle/Belfast councillors getting the best houses, right?
While sad (and, er, are the Polish members of the housing association that gave Mol this house getting their bums felt by the cops? If not, why not?), this sort of stuff goes on the world over.
I am sure you are right, and to be honest, I could not care less about the Mol's housing thing. It was just a story that moved the case on a bit.
BR wrote: "If the guy had been a Pole then the reaction would have taken on a different character."
<>< Yea, the Polish reaction to Mol is sorta like the reaction of youse Britz when a Pole gets busted in the UK.
Also isn't "murzyn" more like "negro"?
It is. However, contrary to English where this word has been declared un-PC, in Polish it has no negative connotations (aside from being sometimes used to describe a low-payed, low-skilled worker, i.e. "they treat us like white negros!").
And doesn't "czarny" mean "black"?
Yes. However, czarnuch is derogatory.
I always thought the derogatory term, the equivalent of the n-word, is "asfalt."
Correct.
Regarding Simon Mol:
It was very unfortunate for Polish antiracist activists that there are virtually no minorities in Poland. They badly needed someone to defend -- and Simon Mol stepped in to fill a role of the so much needed racism victim icon. Unfortunately the icon turned out to be a con.
Still regarding use of the "un-PC" word "murzyn", it has been probably best summarized about 10 years ago by a Polish artist Kazik Staszewski:
Dowiedziałem się że pastor King nie był Murzynem; ani czarnym; on był Afroamerykaninem (I have learned that minister King was not a Negro, nor black; he was an African-american).
I suppose it comes down to the question of whether black Africans make a positive contribution to Europe in the end. I tend to have a negative view on this one. Oh, and I lived in Africa for quite a while, so I know how their societies operate (or don't).
JON
Seems to me that the "African-American" designation is very 70s-80s. And MLK Jr. called himself a "Negro" back in the 60s. I spoze if there was a poll taken, and there prolly has been, most __________ would simply prefer to have themselves referred to or refer to themselves as Blacks or Black Americans. But I could be wrong. Did Simon Mol refer to himself as an African-Pole?
Anonymous said...
I suppose it comes down to the question of whether black Africans make a positive contribution to Europe in the end.. I tend to have a negative view on this one
Considering that the current level of welfare and technological developement in Europe would not be possible without the black slavery and the pillage of African resources, and, conversely, since we do not know, how the African societies would have developed on their own, I'd say that any African, who wants to come and live in Europe, has the moral right to do so.
In any case, this is irrelevant to the case of Simon Mol, who is a refugee , not an immigrant .
Geez said
Yea, the Polish reaction to Mol is sorta like the reaction of youse Britz when a Pole gets busted in the UK.
No it isn't Geez...racism, stereotypes, prejudices are all historically and socially contextual. It just ain't the same.
*Sorta* like. There certainly are similarities. And differences. And parallels that bridge that which is historically and socially contextual.
Considering that the current level of welfare and technological developement in Europe would not be possible without the black slavery
Pray tell, when and where in Europe there were numerous black slaves, and which particular technological advances were related to them? If anything, it was the European technology that made the abolishing of slavery possible, since it decreased the need for manual labor.
and the pillage of African resources,
They are currently being pillaged by everyone in the world.
Pray tell, when and where in Europe there were numerous black slaves, and which particular technological advances were related to them?
And just where did I say there were black slaves in Europe? Just how do you think was the industrial revolution paid for? The main trade goods of the 18th and 19th century - cotton, coffee, sugar, tobacco - all depended on slave labour. Not to mention the capital created by the slave trade.
Should have been "early 19th century"
Careful everybody - new blogger is playing up again - right click and copy comments before trying to post....
Mr Fink-nottle
The exploitation of Africans didn’t stop with the slave trade. That was just the start. Next stop was empire building and colonialism. That was the stage that was crucial for the development of capitalism – not the slave trade. And still today, after the Brits and all got kicked out of Africa, they are still suffering from inequalities of terms of trade. Look at the shitty EU – basically a protectionist racket which hinders African and other developing countries compete.
Or how about the actions of the World bank, IMF etc, which set what in effect were monetarist conditions on loans.
And then we have the new stage – ‘humanitarian intervention’ – a kind of bleeding hearts imperialism. Africans cannot manage themselves so we are just going to have to either send in the troops (Somalia) or the NGOs….
Of course this solves nothing, but further dis-empowers Africans….
So it goes on, and on…
As regards that old chestnut of the right – PC and what to call ‘engross’, blacks’, African Americans’…
These changes of self naming are political developments. The term ‘Black’ came about because whites decided to call them engross – a derogatory term – like ‘queer’. So with the advent of the civil rights movement the term black (and gay) emerged as a term in which groups reclaimed the language that described them. Post black power this term became African-American as a sign of heritage (this is the phase of ‘multiculturalism, where groups compete for status, victim or otherwise).
We have also had the reclaiming of the term ‘nigger’ – as in ‘you one bad nigger’ meaning a positive….same as ‘queer studies’…
So groups have a perfect right to be called what they like and everyone should respect that.
I don’t call Poles polkas because it is derogatory and a sign of disrespect.
It’s all very simple, really. It’s about respect.
Mr Fink-nottle
The exploitation of Africans didn’t stop with the slave trade....
Yes, of course. That's why I said in my original post: "the black slavery AND the pillage of African resources". But you are right about it still going on.
I don’t call Poles polkas ...
Polkas? Where is that word used as an insult? I heard "Polack".
I don’t call Poles polkas because it is derogatory and a sign of disrespect.
It’s all very simple, really. It’s about respect.
Beatroot, watch out - you are on the way to accepting the premise of political correctness :)
beatroot:
These changes of self naming are political developments.
Except these developments have happened in a particular social and language context. There is no basis for forcibly copying them into other languages and/or cultures, where such context is missing. In fact in Polish translations of American movies etc. the term "nigger" is translated as derogatory "czarnuch", and not as literal "Murzyn", because the latter has no strong negative connotations.
The same way we don't call American leftists "liberals", because for us this word has a different meaning.
Now, if we has a significant black minority that objected to the word "Murzyn"... but we don't.
If someone called me a polka I would smash em in the face.
And I agree that this is dangerous PC territory. But 'Murzyn' does reflect a reality - racial prejudice. It ain't no compliment. Although when you tell Poles that 'black' is more acceptable in English it doesn't translate very well...in fact it gets worse!
So what is the "pc" term for Black folks in the current Polish context?
Black culture has never been all that monolithic. Different strokes for different folks, 'n all dat.
And now Chris Rock has turned around the use of the n-word yet once again, much to the utter freak out of some black folks but not others, Go figure:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_q8LxO4wnCQ
geez, the most negative things I've ever read about poland are written by polish participants in internet forums, where the country is called Ciemnogród (roughly Dullsville or Dumbsville) and gets progressively worse.
As a non-pole I'm certainly under no illusion that I'm allowed to play that particular game (not that I want to). The simple fact is that insiders can use bad language about their own group that would be objectionable for outsiders to use. Why is this so hard to understand?
As for the pc term for black, i'd say it depends on context. If it's not imporant, why mention it at all? The correct designation for Serena Williams (for example) is Amerykanka, period.
The word murzyn doesn't bother me and it sounds better than the alternatives when mention of race is appropriate.
I understand what you're saying, Michael, but there are many black folk like Bill Cosby who find the n-word inappropriate in any context. So insiders who use "bad language" are not abided by all within their own group.
Time for me to rewatch The Big Lebowski (an individual not to be confused with The Dude). The Dude abides.
That is an authentic conflict of interests.
Europejczyk…
I am really sorry but the comment you made was deleted by mistake. My fault. I was trying to delete a comment I made which had lots of sppeeling mistakes. Sorry. There is something very odd going odd with blogger software here…
So post again.
But one of the bits of your comment said:
Simon Mol has Polish citizenship. (He travels on a Polish passport.) So he is a Pole by law. Wouldn't calling him a non-Pole be an expression of "ethnocentrism" or - heaven forbid - "racism"?
With respect, nationality is NOT a legal matter….it goes deeper than that. Much deeper in the case of Poland.
And you ‘thesis’ that this is all about Mol being a media figure is what is the ONLY factor in the story is…well, weak.
What is important about this is the conflation of an unholy alliance: HIV, race, media, and Polish-ness.
You know that too…you know you do…
forums, where the country is called Ciemnogród (roughly Dullsville or Dumbsville) and gets progressively worse.
Not quite right.
Ciemnogród was initially a derogatory term used by Gazeta Wyborcza et consortes to describe national-conservative-catholic right political groups (particularly former ZChN, to lesser extent now PiS) and their followers. It later became extended to everyone not alligned with Michnik et.al's "progressive" worldview, and consequently to the general population (which is for a larger part socially conservative). E.g. if you are opposing abortion you qualify as a member of Ciemnogrod.
It should be however noted that certain right-wing people have reclaimed the term and are using it with pride (cf. Wojciech Cejrowski).
Simon Mol has Polish citizenship. (He travels on a Polish passport.) So he is a Pole by law. Wouldn't calling him a non-Pole be an expression of "ethnocentrism" or - heaven forbid - "racism"?
In Poland the term Pole means someone of Polish nationality (ancestry), regardless of citizenship. This is probably a leftover from the times there was no Polish state, and Poland was divided between three neighboring states, making Poles their citizens. Which means that Mr. Kowalsky with an American passport is Polish, whereas Mr. Mol with a Polish passport is not. (Well, if he declared himself to be a Pole there would be some case to call him that way, despite ancestry. A large number of Poles have "non-Polish" ancestors anyway).
Poland has historically had a large Jewish minority and a term for a person with Jewish ancestry and Polish citizenship is a "Polish Jew" (poski Żyd). Thus the term for Mr. Mol would be polski Murzyn (note the capitalization is both cases). However our language has not (yet) developed such term, due to a very low number of black Polish citizens...
Interesting thread.....and I would suggest my first remarks have some validity since this thread is so long. If race IS a topic in Poland...and I mean, clearly, it is....then that is partly what drives this thread. If Mol were a Pole, or an Estonian, or even a Ukrainian (not loved, usually, by Poles) the reaction in the press would be different. Mol is innocent until proven guilty....but even if guilty, the fact remains that the coverage has been inflammatory.
steppx and all,
It seems to me that there are only a couple of actual Poles commenting, so I'm not so sure how "big" the issue of race is outside this forum.
Certainly, there are Poles who are prejudiced against Blacks. What percentage of the population shares this denominator and to what extent is very debatable. I'd say, and actually already did, that the problem in the US is much bigger given the relative size and impact of the Black population.
Let's not forget that in the early 1970s, the US had a president who privately, as repeatedly indicated in the transcripts from the Watergate tapes, regularly used the n-word. Seems even the Kaczynskis are more sensitive, liberal-left pc if you will, than that (I think there are all kinds of pc including nationalist, conservative and Catholic pc).
And I don't know how reflective the Polish press is of the Polish population. The "tabloid' press functions to sensationalize everything and raise a ruckus to sell newspapers.
Is Mol being lynched? No. He is going to get his days in court. Will he get a fair trial? My guess is he will. Is he being metaphorically or somesuch lynched by and in the press? Yea, that seems obvious enuff. As BR has repeatedly pointed out the press in the UK affords Polish visitors and immigrants more than their fair share of abuse too.
Just wondering, too, how many Poles or Estonians or Ukrainians in Poland have actually done all that Mol has been charged with?
Okay, I'll try to get the second half of my post together again (the first was about Mol's passport).
My remark was that the problem with Mol's behavior, that what made his case a public affair, is NOT the color of his skin. To illustrate my point of view, I gave an example of an everyday behavior of Poles and non-Poles: a job offer in exchange for sex. Why do we have a "Samoobrona sex affair" and not a "XXX sex affair," "XXX" standig for the name of an immigrant from overseas who runs a small shop in a suburb of Warsaw? If "race" in fact does matter so much in Poland, as some bloggers assume, we should expect just the opposite. But Mr. "XXX" is a "nobody," whereas the Samoobrona politicians are well-known public figures. An individual who stands in the limelight must expect that his deeds are judged far more critically than those of a "nameless" citizen, independent of the color of his skin. Especially if the prominent person betrays the values he stood for in public.
Simon Mol did everything to stand in the limelight. He stylized himself as a warrior against corruption and for human rights. He skilfully played the "race" card to get advantages for him. Is it "racism" to remind him and his "fans" of this fact?
Geez said:
Ciemnogród was initially a derogatory term used by Gazeta Wyborcza et consortes to describe national-conservative-catholic right political groups (particularly former ZChN, to lesser extent now PiS) and their followers
Not true. "Ciemnogród" comes from a novel of S. K. Potocki "Podróz do Ciemnogrodu" ("Journey to Darkville") published in 1820, so its pedigree is long and honourable (Potocki was one of the main proponents of ideas of Enlightenment in Poland).
albert wrote:
"Europejczyk – you’re really full of crap ... Obviously you know very little about either one of the cultures you chose to volunteer your poorly articulated and grammatically flawed opinion. Ignorance is not flattering."
Sorry, I'm not accustomed to this level of discussion. I just would like to remark that, in academia, a person who cannot but argument ad hominem, disqualifies himself for discourse.
But let me take "albert"'s example of alleged Polish racism:
"I remember my own mother wanting the assurances that my fiancee (now wife) was not by any chance anything other than white."
Let us look at an average Yidishe mamme from Brooklyn, NY. She will do everything within her power that her beloved yingele will NOT marry a goyishe shikse. Or let us look at an average head of a Turkish family in Berlin-Kreuzberg, Germany. He won't object if his son seeks premarital "experience" with German girls (or Polish girls - there are a lot of them in Berlin). But he will force his son to MARRY a Turkish girl, preferably imported from deep Anatolia, as the Turkish girls who grew up in Europe are already "tainted" by Western ideas. Or visit YouTube, crawl for "Polish girls," and hear how the African guys slanderously belittle them.
What will the promotors of "multiculturalism, "anti-Racism," etc. tell you about this? Oh, the African guys only made a joke (LOL). The Jewish mother and the Turkish father deserve praise because they defended their cultural identity. But the behavior of the Polish mother is despicable, it is "racist." Why doesn't SHE have the right to defend HER cultural identity, not even in the country where she and her ancestors have lived for centuries? Because she is white and Christian?
I stick to my statement: Poles are not more (and probably also not less) "racist" than other people. There is quite a lot of xenophobia in Poland, admittedly, and regretfully the ruling PiS and LPR leaders fuel this attitude as a way to unite the country behind them. But there is so much warm-heartedness in Poland, so much hospitality among the people, so much openness toward the world. And I'm glad that I, as a white and Christian individual, can walk through every neighborhood of Lodz, Warsaw, or Cracow without fearing to be beaten or even killed because I'm not Turkish (Berlin, Frankfurt), Arab (Paris), or Afro-American (Washington D.C.). The worst I can expect is being pick-pocketed.
Never wrote what you attribute to me, Fink. So you need to get your basics straight, too, though, I do appreciate the information about the novel.
e-czyk, aside from your reductionism vis-a-vis advocates of multiculturalism and liberals-leftists, e-czyk, I think you are pretty much on target with your comments above.
A hilarious (very sad?) reality radio bit where a Jewish daughter plays a trick on her parents about marrying an Italian guy can be found at:
http://www.glumbert.com:80/media/italiandate
And by the way, comedian Chris Rock informs us that American Blacks are afraid of being robbed and beaten by American Blacks, too:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_q8LxO4wnCQ
I should note as well that if I was Black, I'd be afraid of driving around in the suburbs of America especially upon seeing the flashing lights of a police car.
Sorry Geez,
It was opamp, of course. I need glasses...
europejczyk wrote:
And I'm glad that I, as a white and Christian individual, can walk through every neighborhood of Lodz, Warsaw, or Cracow without fearing to be beaten or even killed
This is certainly true. On the other hand, were you dark-skinned, your chances of not being abused or beaten would be much smaller in Poland than in the UK, West Germany or France.
Do other folks here think the same way as the finker does above? I'm not sure if I agree or disagree.
fink-nottle,
Not true. "Ciemnogród" comes from a novel of S. K. Potocki
This is true, however I was commenting on its contemporary usage.
europejczyk,
I fully agree.
As regards - per capita of course - attacks on blacks in Poland compared to France, UK etc...then prove that.
Which you will have trouble doing as attacks on blacks is infamously under reported here.
Mol has been attacked at least twice since he was here. And he tells a story about an incident in KFC with two other Africans, when one of them was attacked by some peace loving Polish gentlemen. The KFC security guy just stood and watched.
Mol complained to the manager, who offered them by way of compensation....some free fried chicken!
Seems like Mol told lots of stories.
And well, he was in a KFC, not a bowling alley.
So Poland is so much worse than the US for gays?
A catchy little fundy American Christian song: God hates Fags.
http://www.glumbert.com/media/godhates
Hi all, I am Polish and I read all the comments in this topic but I have specialy focused on dispute about 'murzyn' word. It made laugh.
People who speak Polish worse than I speak English are trying to prove that word 'murzyn' has bad co-notations.
I can say in Polish:
Mój najlepszy przyjaciel jest Murzynem. (My very best frient is 'murzyn').
It means that IS my best friend and just has black skin.
Word 'murzyn' has nothing to do with 'neger' or Polish 'czarnuch' or 'asfalt' that are realy bad words.
There is also a poem for kids that starts:
"Murzynek Bambo w Afryce mieszka, czarna ma skórę ten nasz koleżka (...)"
(murzynek means 'a little murzyn-boy'
Do you think that this spreads hate???
About Mol - he is just a piece of sh**t after what he did, no metter what his color or nationality is. I would say the same about him even if he would be white man born in Poland (or whoever else).
Best regards to all :)
Maciek
sp2qbn
It´s a shame that there are people capable of defending MURDERERS like Mol just because he is black.
So much political correcteness makes me sick.
It´s a pity Mol and those who still support him, will have a hard life in Poland from now on...
Konrad
Actually the debate we are having here is not about ‘defending’ Mol, or otherwise – it’s about the societal reaction to what he has been accused of.
Maybe a little too subtle for you…
«Maybe a little too subtle for you...»
The eternal moral superiority of the leftists...
The fact that Mol and his accomplices (like yourself)are doomed is hard to face isn´t it?
The crimes known now about this RACIST are just the tip of the iceberg.
I can´t wait for his trial...
LOL LOL
The fact that Mol and his accomplices (like yourself)are doomed is hard to face isn´t it?
Look, if you want to be taken seriously then stop talking such nonsense…’accomplices’…don’t be a such a fool…and try and read and understand what the debate is about before you comment…
In my opinion Polish society don't care about Mol. He was assumed by people as criminalist.
The worst problem was a reaction of people for the bahavior of girls who sticked with him.
The color of the skin has nothing to do here. Most of people I know call these girls 'whores' (dziwki).
To tell you the truth I do not know no man who had over 100 girls in 7 years.
It is hard to belive that those girls went to bed with him. What did they tink about? Shame for those girls...
And once again: Simon Mol is just a criminalist and betrader of ideas. and that is how Polish society recives him. The colour of his skin has secondary meaning at this point (if it has at all).
Maciek
sp2qbn
P.S.
Forgive my my English. I hope you understand what I mean although it seems to me that some sentences that I wrote are just simple translation word-to-word from Polish into English.
I know polish girls quite well.
From my experience, only fat ugly sluts or political correct masochists would touch scum like Mol.
I have been travelling to Poland since 2002 for business, as I have a successful real estate business here. Unlike Simon and similar parasites , I don´t come here to get aid from Poles but to invest a lot of money in Poland.
In these 5 years, I dated and had sex with well over ONE HUNDRED VERY ATTRACTIVE Polish girls.
And I never needed to force them to do anything they didn´t want or blak mail them as did this neanderthal.
Most of my female friends consider MOL, ugly repulsive , primitive and first of all , a CRIMINAL.
By the way,for those who talk about racism , the only time I felt threatened in Warsaw was 2 years ago, when a black tried to mug me late at night.
Unfortunately, I´m a Kung Fu expert.
And I didn´t leave him until he was lying on the floor with a broken nose and a few missing teeth.
Unfortunately I didn´t have my revolver with me...
Wow Anon, I'm sure we're all really impressed by your sexual prowess and mastery of kung-fu, not to mention all your money.
But hey, did you know Malgorzata did Mol? And Marta who did Magdelena who did Mol? Let us know when your dick turns green.
Or better yet, just let it fall off and don't waste our time with your bullshit.
Another jealous loser...
t.love is just upset because his RACIST friend Mol was exposed as a SCAMMER, LIAR AND MURDERER.
Pity he can´t keep on living like a parasite.
He deserves nothing than being feed in jail with dirty water and rotten bread.
So, Maciek sp2qbn, I understand you perfectly. And I agree that much of the reaction to his case was to blame the girls!
Which is interesting in itself, don’t you think?
You say that Most of people I know call these girls 'whores' (dziwki)..
And that seems to be backed up by the ignorant ‘real estate’ pig who claims to ‘know Polish girls quite well’ (oh, really?) who says From my experience, only fat ugly sluts or political correct masochists would touch scum like Mol. and then the same real estate man claims that he ‘slept with 100 Polish girls’ …
…but those girls he does not seem to consider ‘fat ugly sluts’
….interesting…
Then the same Mr real estate man says ‘the only time I felt threatened in Warsaw was 2 years ago, when a black tried to mug me late at night…. Unfortunately, I´m a Kung Fu expert.’
)))
No, real estate man, you are a pathetic little fantacist with a black belt in bullshit..
So what we have is a combination of primitive racist and sexism – the worst of which, on this blog, has come from a non-Pole.
Interesting…
Boy, are those real estate guys hot.
Only beaten by used cars salesmen...
Beat 'rote about real estate man's proclaimed conquests: "but those girls he does not seem to consider ‘fat ugly sluts’"
..... My guess is that they were skinny ugly sluts. And dumber than the law allows. So dumb that they'd do a guy in a polyester suit.
Beatroot shows his real character behind his mask of political correcteness.
Not only he´s a rude dirty bastard but he´s also a jealous loser.
AS well as being an active antifascist he´s also a jealous anticapitalist.
Bad for him, most polish people don´t bite his leftism bullshit.
«RACIST, SEXIST , FASCIST» were exactly the terms used by MOL ( A MURDERER) to insult those who dare to contradict him.
It seems Beatroot and MOL have many things in common.
May be the beatroot is eager to be awarded with the prize of ANTIFASCIST of the year now that his friend is senteced to death.
It seems you were sorry for the bastard who tried to steal my wallet at Marzalkowska just because I smashed his face?
May be I should have given him all my money because after all...he was just a victim of society.
By the way, you don´t know me ...but already know where to find you!
After all, it´s a small world isn´t it?
And I have many polish friends who also would like to congratulate you
for defending a criminal and a useless parasite.
That such diseased pc creatures as Mol (left) and Anon (idiot) above should exist.
Tis a pity.
Lord, have mercy on their corrupt souls
Just a small detail:
MOL is aparasite-he lived at the expense of polish taxpayers and deliberately infected polish girls with HIV.
In what way has this monster contributed to the development of Poland?
Anon invested his money in this country, PAYS TAXES ( unlike Mol), pays salaries ( unlike Mol) and don't blackmail people( unlike Mol).
Probably this is the reason why left wing journalists like Beatroot are furious with this story.
And 99% of the polish peole are not stupid to be brainwashed by them.
Decades of communism were enough.
Before the polyester-clad sexually frustrated real-estate moron came here, there was a post by a different anon, who said:
There is also a poem for kids that starts:
"Murzynek Bambo w Afryce mieszka, czarna ma skórę ten nasz koleżka (...)"
(murzynek means 'a little murzyn-boy'
Do you think that this spreads hate???
No, but it spreads condescension and it is a very racist poem (later lines say that Bambo climbes trees and is afraid that milk will whiten his skin). I think this poem has a lot to answer for: it basically tells young children that racism is OK.
Real estate man says:
By the way, you don´t know me ...but already know where to find you!
After all, it´s a small world isn´t it?
Oh dear oh dear oh dear. Actually I do know quite a lot about you, including host name, provider, location etc…
When someone tries to make these kind of personal threats it’s a sure sign they are losing the argument.
Are you really that unconfident in your point of view? Are you really that insecure? Are you so inarticulate that you cannot form arguments without that kind of nonsense? Are you that inadequate?
Sad, very sad.
Expect more of this kind of stuff, readers, as a forum called ‘Pan Aryan National Front” has posted something about Mol and this blog and it getting a few visitors from there at the moment. I quoted some of the bile they wrote about this case in early January.
And you are correct Fink-Nottle about the ‘harmless’ little child’s poem that another ‘anon’ – a Polish one this time – fails to see anything wrong with.
Polish Anon has just proved, without meaning to, that ‘Murzyn’ does have racist connotations in much the same way as ‘wog’ had when I was a child, way back when.
So when people say that there is a kind of childish racial prejudice here – in the same way that there was in Britain in the 1970s, this is the kind of thing they mean…
Gussie: GET LOST SUCKER!
«FASCIST , RACIST» were the terms used by MOL-the social parasite, every time he found opposition.
Like the leftist rats in this shithole.
Pity, your friend won´t stay alive for a long time.
Don´t forget to put some red carnations on grave of the antifascist of the year.
Pity some people are already planning to spit on his grave in case he is buried in Poland.
LOLlOL
"Pan Aryan National Front” has Polish members? That's really funny: do they really not know what the Nazis planned for the Slavs?
Did I forget to mention I´m not using my own computer?
Never mind!
We´ll meet one of these days and
you´ll be very surprised as I don´t correspond at all with your stereotype of the «bigot bad guy».
Otherwise, I wouldn´t have so many friends in Poland...nice and friendly people I never had to blackmail like someone else did...
Anonymous said...
Did I forget to mention I´m not using my own computer?
Amazing. A scared little rat...
«Mol cleverly used "race" as a tool to gain popularity and profit and to fight critics.
Who wonders that now, when the truth comes to light, the "race" weapon fires back? »
WHO LIVES BY THE SWORD WILL DIE BY THE SWORD!
One can well imagine what would happen to an Aids infected Pole who spread his disease among scores of Black women in Cameroon....
Forgive me please... but I am realu upset how people like gussie fink-nottle see racism all around them. Those people are even more narrowminded and stupid than catholic's 'mohery' (mohery - people who support DJ Rydzyk :)
Here goes the original 'Bambo' by Julian Tuwim:
Bambo
Murzynek Bambo w Afryce mieszka,
Czarną ma skórę ten nasz koleżka.
Uczy się pilnie przez całe ranki
Ze swej murzyńskiej "Pierwszej czytanki".
A gdy do domu ze szkoły wraca,
Psoci, figluje - to jego praca.
Aż mama krzyczy: "Bambo, łobuzie!"
A Bambo czarną nadyma buzię.
Mama powiada: "Chodz do kąpieli",
A on się boi, że się wybieli.
Lecz mama kocha swojego synka,
Bo dobry chłopak z tego Murzynka.
Szkoda, że Bambo czarny, wesoły
Nie chodzi razem z nami do szkoły.
I do not feen capable to translate it into English good enough, but trust me that there is nothing that would tell kids that racism is OK.
Of course - Bambo is afraid that he will get while after his mother call him to wash... but as far as I remember from my childhood I tried to avoid washing too :)
The las sentense of the poem says that it is a pity that Bambo is not going to school with us together.
I knew this poem (as a child) very well and the only feeling that it brought to me was that I wanted to meet some 'murzynek Bambo' to play with him or to visit him in Africa.
People! take a dip breath and relax!
Maciek
sp2qbn
OK. Here is a counting rhyme that we used to say when I was a kid back in London. It comes from a Rudyad Kipling (author of ‘White Man’s Burden remember) from 1923
Eenee, Meenee, Mainee, Mo!
Catch a nigger by the toe!
If he hollers let him go!
Eenee, Meenee. Mainee, Mo!
You-are-It!
Now we used to say that in the playground without ever thinking about what it meant.
But of course it did have racial connotations and kids do not say it these days. And good.
I think that Poland is at the same backward stage as the British were thirty years ago.
What about this Beatroot?
(If this guy was white and talking about african girls I´m sure Beatroot & associates would ban the video.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lbk2-vl2BDA
But of course it did have racial connotations and kids do not say it these days. And good.
Getting rid of a piece of your culture because it was ideologically incorrect is not good - it is doubleplusgood!
No, but it spreads condescension and it is a very racist poem
Wow. In that spirit, we should throw out all of important texts in our current school curriculum because they are waaaay more xenophobic/racist than that. So we would produce a new generation of politically correct Poles with absolutely no idea what a national identity is. Except the only reason this country still exists is constant patriotic indoctination of children over the period of last 200 years. So we will keep that racist/xenophobic stuff, thank you very much. After all, since certain minorities in your [UK] progressive society are allowed to say openly that certain groups of people should be physically eliminated, our xenophobia shouldn't be much of a problem.
Oh, and by the way, how is the elimination of Christmas in favor of politically correct winter holidays progressing?
I think that Poland is at the same backward stage as the British were thirty years ago.
Like it was a bad thing. Britain has been going down the drain recently.
opamp –
'catching niggers by their toe' is not 'ideologically incorrect’…it is just insulting.
When you live, work and have friends, lovers, wives. relatives that are from non-white backgrounds then it is simply not possible to continue with this kind of ‘gollywog’ colonialist nonsense.
And what about this nonsense:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lbk2-vl2BDA
PLEASE COMMENT!
It was already posted in hundreds of polish blogs to show the real nature of Simon´s friends.
And most people are not happy about this...
ONE PICTURE IS WORTH A THOUSAND WORDS.
Anon: How freaking stupid can you be?
That video on youtube was posted by a Polish jokester (whose sense of humor is akin to that of a malignant tumor). My guess is that jokester was you.
I base my conclusion on the deeply held belief that there can't be anybody else quite so peculiarly pucked fup as you.
On the other hand, I guess Americans will soon have to dump Mark Twain, too.
What about these nice songs:
( Mol would love this lyrics)
“Niggas in the church say: kill whitey all night long. . . . the white man is the devil. . . . the CRIPS and Bloods are soldiers I’m recruiting with no dispute; drive-by shooting on this white genetic mutant. . . . let’s go and kill some rednecks. . . . Menace Clan ain’t afraid. . . . I got the .380; the homies think I’m crazy because I shot a white baby; I said; I said; I said: kill whitey all night long. . . . a nigga dumping on your white ass; fuck this rap shit, nigga, I’m gonna blast. . . . I beat a white boy to the motherfucking ground”;
“Kill Whitey”; Menace Clan, Da Hood, 1995, Rap-A-Lot Records, Noo Trybe Records, subsidiaries of what was called Thorn EMI and now is called The EMI Group, United Kingdom
More:
A fight, a fight, a nigger and a white, if the nigger don’t win then we all jump in. . . . smoking all [of] America’s white boys”;
“A Fight”; Apache, Apache Ain’t Shit, 1993, Tommy Boy Music, Time Warner, USA.
And more:
“Now I’m black but black people trip [become upset] ‘cause white people like me; white people like me but don’t like them. . . . I don’t hate whites, I just gotta death wish for motherfuckers that ain’t right”
“Race War”; Ice-T, Home Invasion, 1993, Priority Records, Thorn EMI; now called The EMI Group, United Kingdom.
And more:
“I pledge allegiance to only the black. . . . black, you had best prepare for the coming of war. . . . look at you devil; now you’re sweating; I’m telling you: you can’t run from the hand of Armageddon. . . . he eats his pig-steak rare so he can taste the blood”
“No Time”; RBX, The RBX Files, 1995, Premeditated Records, Warner Brother Records, Time Warner, USA.
“Killing devils [and] scatter they ashes over the sea of Mediterranean. . . . open your eyes to the revolution. . . . unite with the black coalition”
“Wake Up”; Killarmy, Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars, 1997, Wu-Tang Records, Priority Records, The EMI Group, United Kingdom.
If you want more just ask.
YOU STILL TALK ABOUT RACISM?
ANSWER BEATROOT!
LOOK BEATROOT:
Another victim of RACISM:
Homeowner accused of arson insurance schemeApparent hate crime turned into 'dumb crook' tale
By Ted Oberg
(1/17/07 - KTRK/HOUSTON) - We thought it was a hate crime. Now investigators say it was just the work of a dumb crook.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Also on ABC13.com:
Send news tips | RSS | ABC13 E-lert | Info mentioned on air | Search abc13.com
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
It did take them 15 months to file a charge. But now that they've laid their case out, it all seems to make sense.
Investigators thought it was strange when neighbors saw the man moving all sorts of stuff out of his home 20 hours before it caught fire. But they had to untangle bank records and racial slurs before the light bulbs really went off.
For 15 months fire marshals say Samuel White got away with arson, until these light bulbs unraveled his whole plan.
Sr. Fire Investigator Dustin Deutsch said, "Everything you could do wrong he did wrong. Everything you shouldn't do, he did do."
On October 11, 2005 the home White had owned for five years caught fire. When the fire was out, investigators found racial slurs spray painted on 14 walls. They thought it was a hate crime.
"It actually brings a spotlight to a house -- a crime that shouldn't be there," Deutsch said.
But when you look a little closer -- the slurs are misspelled and the swastikas are backwards. So maybe the perpetrator wasn't a good student of hate -- or maybe it wasn't a hate crime at all.
Deutsch explained, "It's a textbook case of homeowner involved insurance arson scheme."
It turns out Mr. White owed back taxes, insurance, mortgage and homeowner's fees. The house was days from foreclosure. A fire dog found the strong scent of gasoline all over the home.
The photos of the fire show there's no furniture, no blinds on the windows, no appliances and no bathroom light bulbs. Investigators say they found the blinds at the home of White's girlfriend. A refrigerator was in her garage. And they found a box of eight bathroom light bulbs on the floor there, too.
"The entire neighborhood saw this man take a refrigerator, landscape rocks, blinds, light bulbs within 24 hours of the fire out of the house," Deutsch said.
It was enough to get White charged with arson, but investigators can't find him. He led Houston cops on a chase on November 3 and he's on bond for that. But apparently he's still running.
If it was insurance fraud, it worked for a time. The bank was paid its back mortgage and investigators tell us Mr. White was paid about $10,000. He denied involvement to investigators and has not been arrested yet.
(Copyright © 2007, KTRK-TV)
http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?section=local&id=4946233
Listen – I am getting lots of anonymous comments, so maybe some are not from ‘Real Estate Man’…I cannot distinguish one from another.
And I cannot be bothered to go to the statcounter to work out who is who. So I will just say the following to Real Estate Man:
Let me just remind you what you have vomited on my blog (by the way, you have just stumbled on the most read blog (in English) in Central Europe and certainly one of the most lively, intelligent (in English) blogs in mainland Europe. So I think you are in the wrong place, frankly.
You said:.
By the way, you don´t know me ...but already know where to find you!
After all, it´s a small world isn´t it?
And I have many polish friends who also would like to congratulate you
for defending a criminal and a useless parasite….
…We´ll meet one of these days and
you´ll be very surprised as I don´t correspond at all with your stereotype of the «bigot bad guy»…..
And then you (I think) say…
YOU STILL TALK ABOUT RACISM?
ANSWER BEATROOT!
No, I am not going to answer because I think you are a complete wanker!
Listen: As you can see by this thread, the one that you originally came in on…
http://beatroot.blogspot.com/2007/01/racists-enjoy-mol-hiv-case.html
….I do not censor your sort of racist shit.
I am a free speech fundamentalist (and certainly not a liberal PC-er) because I think letting your sort of bile hang in the wind – so obviously full of vile shit - your political cause is harmed more by leaving it there than censoring it.
But you have made (lame) personal threats against me.
You and people like you do not scare me. In fact, I feel pity for marginalized, fantacist types like you. Ooo you had 100 girls in Poland….ooo you are a kung fu expert.
Give me a break!!!!
Listen: this blog is for intelligent people who want to debate politics. You can express any political point of view you like here – even if it is your sort of pathetic racist shite.
But once you try and threaten me then you are not worth responding to.
So go away and play with your equally marginalized, pathetic, cowardly, laughable idiots somewhere else.
«...by the way, you have just stumbled on the most read blog (in English) in Central Europe and certainly one of the most lively, intelligent (in English) blogs in mainland Europe. So I think you are in the wrong place, frankly.»
OH dear!
This guy is so proud of himself!
As usual, the moral superiority of the left.
But you choose the wrong country to live in as most poles can´t stand commies like you.
«Bigot, racist, etc, etc.»
The "Compassionate Left" in action...
We all know that criminals and specially «minorities» no matter what they do, are always victims of society.Don't we?
By the way, loser, how many salaries do you pay to polish workers?
At least I create wealth.
I hope at least you pay taxes in Poland.
Or you just live at the expense of polish tax payers, like your friend Mol?
Shame on you who come here, insult polish culture and even defend criminals.
YOU ARE EVEN MORE RACIST THAN SIMON MOL!!!!!!!!!!!
This is just sad. It's really sad that this tragedy has become nothing more than a catalyst for both sides on the idiot spectrum to prove who is "right". Although I really love reading "tough-guy" anonymous comments. This just proves how truly stupid people are.
Anonymous... Mr Luridtraversal?
I would like to bring the discussion back to the underlying question: How do Poles in Poland cope with the problems that the opening of the borders and the influx of non-Poles into their country after 1989 brought with them? I would like to put aquesteion: Is it really necessary TODAY to have all students read Mickiewicz's "Konrad Wallenrod" and Sienkiewicz's "Trylogia" and "W pustyni i w puszczy" at school, and to examine them about these texts? A hundred years ago these works of literature had a political function: to ideologically unite the Polish people who lived under three different occupational powers and under the pressure of germanization or russification. The inherent tendency in these works, to glorify Poland and the Poles and to vilify their neigbors as "eternal enemies," however, had problematic side-effects: it has for generations poisoned the relations of Poland with her neighbors, as the late Czeslaw Milosz stated with regret. "W pustyni i w puszczy," in addition, presents all stereotypes about Africa that were prevalent at the turm of the 20th century: the noble and intelligent White, the treacherous Arab, the good-natured, but childish Negro. I remember vividly the special screening of "W pustyni i w puszczy" for schoolchildren in the biggest movie theater of Cracow, 3 or 4 years ago. About 2,000 seventh- and eight-graders applauded frenetically to the scene in which Stas, the 14-year-old protagonist, kills the Arabs with a rifle he had just stolen from them. And the "murzyn" Kali is still a proverbial figure in Poland standing for a person with a double moral standard. What is Tuwim's little "racist" verse - which nobody learns any more - against Sienkiewicz's oeuvre?
Good stuff. but if the present educational secretary would have his way then areturn to the kind of education you remember is on the cards.
But you are right: coping with the new (very modest) immigration to Poland is a bog leap for Polish society. This immigration will incrase as Poland becomes wealthier amd labour shortage becomes more accute.
So this is an important issue indeed.
Just reading this blog.. I've found it by accident searching for totally different thing. Few comments:
"Murzyn" is not offending, nor racist. It's a perfectly normal word. Just like "Rumun" is perfectly neutral word for person of Romanian nationality, despite that it got a lot of negative connotations recently.
Murzynek Bambo is not offending. It present merry little typical boy, who is different from Polish boys only because he lives in Africa. For your information, I climb on trees when I was young and I was fascinated, as a child, by fantasy that in Africa i could escape from my mother by climbing the tree in the jungle. What's more, the African boy is proud of his skin color (he doesn't want to be white!). The all descriptive words are positive ("merry", "assiduous" etc) and the poem ends with "It's a pity that merry and assiduous Bambo does not live amongst us").
As for Simon M. I think the case is clear and many people are feeling certain schadenfreude for this. Antifascist of the year, fighting with racism is suddenly shown as worse kind of rascal. I must confess that I feel strange and embarassing feeling of joy that someone who was supposed to be saint isn't. I feel similar very ugly feeling when I heard about all mistakes of Kaczynski and though I feel ashamed and surprised by that feeling, I can't do anything about it.
And finally, strange how nobody feels pity for the poor girls. The overall attitude is "good for them".
Aaa "climbed" not climb and "black and merry" not "merry and assiduous". "Assiduous" is earlier when he is assiduously learning.
"but mother loves his son, because a good boy is this 'murzynek'" a racist poem, yeah.
Te Chopin,
Just as Beatroot said, we'll talk in 30 years.
So, e-czyk, what novels should Polish teenagers be reading today?
And should American teenagers not read Mark Twain because of his use of racist speech?
Come on geezer,
The message of "Adventures of Huckleberry Finn" is an exact opposite of racism. Huck is a boy from the South, who believes that slavery is something natural. His attitude changes completely in the course of the novel and in the end he decides he will be damned to the flames of hell rather than betray his black friend. And Jim is no sterotype, not a caricature as Kali in Sienkiewicz's novel - he is courageous and noble.
People say sometimes that the novel is racist, because of n-word. It could hardly not be there, given that the story plays in the pre-Abolition South.
Mark Twain being racist is one of the more ridiculous notions: just read "A True Story".
And "W Pustyni i Puszczy" - well, Europejczyk summed it up qiuite well.
Having said that, let the Polish teenagers read "W P i P" - it can be a good starting point for a discussion about race, racism, stereotypes etc.
I should have add that of course you have not suggested that Twain is racist, but the notion does have currency.
Of course, Twain wasn't racist in his later years when he wrote Huck, Tom and his other decidedly anti-racist and anti-slavery books and stories(but he was very much so a racist earlier on in his career, taking more than a few swipes at black folk hat I don't think even Anon would make today. Well, maybe Anon...).
But I think, fink, you better made the point I was trying to make -- let 'em read the books, try to understand them in their historical contexts, and apply what is learned to their present day lives.
But I'd also be interested in finding out from Poles like e-czyk and opamp what kind of books Polish teenagers should be reading today.
(but he was very much so a racist earlier on in his career, taking more than a few swipes at black folk hat ...
Can you give examples?
"... telling popular "nigger jokes" in the 1850's and 60's."
"... after Twain had left the South, he became aware of his wrongful attitudes towards slavery and the black race, and he began to change them."
Aha,
Thanks, didn't know that. Just shows how much the millieu, in which one grows up, matters.
I can’t contribute in this discussion because I know jackshit about American literature. Almost nothing, although I know lots about Brit Lit.
That’s because I am an ex-lefty…and deep within much of British leftism is basically an anti-Americanism. So I ddn’t read the books I should have. Regret that now as it was just one of my prejudices. Thankfully I grew out of that anti-American bullshit.
But I am still behind on the literature. Sad.
Ex-lefty?
Don´t make me laugh!
The author of this blog is leftist to the extreme.
From what I can see, defending criminals ( like Mol) is one of his passions and his main goal now.
Bad for him he has chosen the wrong country to spead his poison.
BR: Y'might start with Charles Bukowski (adamantly not Polish American).
Anon: "From what I can see...."
Maybe glasses or drugs will help.
More info on the Antifascist oo the year.
( My God this bastard is so fucking ugly)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwMxs2t31C0&mode=related&search=
defending criminals ( like Mol) is one of his passions and his main goal now.
Someone is a criminal AFTER they have been CONVICTED. That’s what a criminal is. Ad convictions happen in a COURT OF LAW, not in the media, or in blogs.
If you care to read the discussion above then you will see that we are looking at the context in which all this taking place – not about Mol at all.
And as far as The author of this blog is leftist to the extreme.…I really don’t think you know the meaning of left ad right - or what I think about the subject.
I really don’t think this blog is for people like you – it presents life as a complicated business, full of nuances…you belong in a pre-blog world (actually pre electricity world) like the dark ages (look it up).
And as far as Bad for him he has chosen the wrong country to spead his poison.……don’t you dare try and compare Poles’ reactions to these kind of things with your own primitive mind – Polish society is a little more sophisticated than you are.
Now go back and play with your white supremacist friends, where you belong.
Beatroot shows is tolerant side once again...
Beatroot is exactly like Simon Mol, when he runs out of arguments he sreams : RACIST RACIST like a psycopat.
That´s why he´s so fond of the antifascist of the year ang gives the criminal his total support.
I can´t wait for the trial of the unfortunate refugee LOL
What I particularly enjoy about leftist clowns like Beatroot is their pseudo supeiority in terms of knowledge, culture, whatever.
This guy is so ridiculous.
He claims his blog is the best that he is the best...
Pity you can´t send those who don´t agree with your bullshit to the Gulag anymore like in the good old days?
Why don´t you see a psychiatrist?
He can help mentals like you.
Anon,
Go back to that hole from which you crawled out. This blog is really WAY over your head. Mind you, it looks as if most things are.
Gussie: shut your gob mother fucker!
«Simon Mol always accused everybody of racism. When you didn't do what he wished, he would yell that it was because he was black. He never listened to any arguments, he would always just leave, slamming the door behind him. »
This his exactly the school of thought of Beatroot and his friends.
Anon: ZZZZZzzzzzz.
The brother of the antifascist of the year?
http://www.columbiatribune.com/2006/Dec/20061206News004.asp
And his cousin?
http://wcpo.com/news/2007/local/02/06/rape_suspect.html
Anon,
See? With your every post you prove me right. If I were a leftist, I'd try to excuse you and wonder if it's your parents', or the society's fault? Or maybe some genetic fault kept your IQ at 96?
But I say, sod the reasons. You are just someone for whom the term "white trash" could have been invented.
Look, I know this is hard for you to grasp, but your comments here are an equivalent of a first-grader taking part in a debating society. It's really not for you. The internet is really big, and there MUST be something there suitable to your level.
Alternatively, don't you have to clean your trailer or something?
Trailer?
LOL
Scum like you wouldn´t be allowed in my gated community.
REALLY FUCKER!
You really don't have a single clue about the sort of person I am.
I must confess I´m having great fun since I found the blog of this pseudo elitist asshole.
MY GOD! A gated trailer park!
Man, you've made it.
BTW, anon, of course you haven't understood the rest of my comment? Sorry, it's so hard to avoid two-syllable words.
That's Ok mate!
I´m still looking up some of your words in the dictionary.LOL
Look anon,
Surely this is much more suitable for you. It caters to people like you, don't you agree?
Beatroot wrote: Someone is a criminal AFTER they have been CONVICTED. That’s what a criminal is. Ad convictions happen in a COURT OF LAW, not in the media, or in blogs.
It is not true. Someone is a criminal WHEN they have committed a crime. If it was not the case, Fred West (who committed suicide while in jail awaiting trial - please note here that the Brits lock up people w/o trial as well) could not be branded a criminal (let alone a monster). Technically, FW died an innocent man – somehow it did not matter to the British media (including the Beeb) at that time. Besides, you were the person who first commented on Mol's case in your blog (belting up was an option you should have considered in order not to pre-judge Mol’s case). As I recall, you accused the Poles of racism then (somehow, you felt it was OK to be the judge at this particular juncture). The victims did not matter, and the only thing you were concerned about was the welfare of your acquaintance. After Mol's trial and conviction it would be proper to acknowledge your own bias. Mol can always sue people who publicly call him a criminal for defamation of character – the only little thing he needs to do is to prove that their accusations are untrue (that’s what Jonathan Aitken did, right?). Somehow, I do not see it happening any time soon.
geez asked: "So, e-czyk, what novels should Polish teenagers be reading today?" Thank you for asking this important and necessary question. Please forgive me that I do not dare to give a definitive answer, because I don't feel myself an expert in this field - I did not study polonistyka. But I read a lot of Polish literature, and I would recommend novels such as Lalka by Prus or Przedwiosnie by Zeromski or Granica by Nalkowska, even Zaklente rewiry Worcella, just to mention some older works. I admire modern Polish writers and have read nearly everything written by A. Libera, St. Chwin, P. Huelle, and O. Tokarczuk. My favorite writer of short stories is T. Borowski, but I also like Hanna Krall's writing, not to forget the great Gombrowicz. I am convinced that there is enough good literature written in Polish, regarding the language as well as the content, so that 21st century education does not need to recur on 19th century texts that purvey an outdated worldview. As far as "W pustyni i w puszczy" is concerned, I agree with Augustus F-N: "Let the Polish teenagers read "W P i P" - it can be a good starting point for a discussion about race, racism, stereotypes etc." BTW, I once did the same with Betty Mahmoody's "Not without my daughter."
Gussie:
BTW, do you know why I own a £4,950,000 home in central London?
Not to mention a luxury villa in Southern Europe?
Easy! My first company sold over 50 000 expensive get rich quick schemes to suckers
like Simon Mol.
Those idiots are so gullible!
LOL
Trailer...LOLOL
To beatroot: If indeed only a person finally sentenced by a court can be called "a criminal" - what about Hitler, Himmler, and Goebbels, who never stood trial at all? Or think of all those mafiosi, who never saw a courtroom from inside? What is more, every expert in law will admit that courts not seldom make erroneous decisions: they convict an innocent individual, and acquit a person who committed a crime. Judges and jury members are also only human beings and fallible, like you and me.
Thanks for your answer, e-czyk, regarding a basic reading list. I don't like the idea of an extensive canon but my sense is that there should be at least half a dozen books all teenagers should have to read in every country.
Nemeczek: Someone is a criminal WHEN they have committed a crime.
Which of course is correct. But before we can call someone a criminal we have to prove a criminal act. And the best place to establish a criminal act is in COURT, not the media or blogs like this. Mol will have his day in court and if the charges made against him are true then we will all be disgusted.
Now…
Anonymouse said:Beatroot shows his tolerant side once again...
Who ever said I was tolerant of idiots?
Anon said Beatroot is exactly like Simon Mol, when he runs out of arguments he screams : RACIST RACIST like a psycopat.
Meaning psychopath, I believe. But if you look at the comment he is referring to, there is no mention of RACIST at all. What I said was that you should go back and play with the white supremacist web site which I know that you came to this blog via.
If you don’t want to be known as a weirdo white supremacist then why do you hang around at the Pan Aryan National Front?
You make you bed, son, you lie in it.
Pity you can´t send those who don´t agree with your bullshit to the Gulag anymore
Ooooo! Your skill at political debate is just scary!!!!!!!!!!!
Gussie: shut your gob mother fucker!
And to think creeps like this have inherited Shakespeare’s language…
REALLY FUCKER!
Ooooo ! I bet you do the Times crossword as well…
(remember: this is the guy who, when I reminded him after he made his lame little personal threats against me, that statcounter records all necessary data to know exactly where he is posting from, host name, even what software he is using, he squealed: “but I am not using my own computer…weee….wee…weee.”)
What make of disposable diapper do you use, exactly?
Anonymouse said: BTW, do you know why I own a £4,950,000 home in central London?
Not to mention a luxury villa in Southern Europe?
Ah, yes. This is the same guy who claims to have ‘had’ 100 Polish women in 5 years and is an expert in Kung Fu.
Why do I not believe a single word you say?
Really, I have read your comments on other sites and this is just about the best you can do. isn’t it? This is a blog for grown ups and the people who comment here – who I don’t agree with on many things – are generally intelligent people who can hold a debate.
You are not. Go away and mix with your own kind.
Why do I not believe a single word you say?
Because you are stupid!
I don´t care about it at all, loser.
Pity some of the «bigots» beatroot hates so much make more money in one month than the faggot makes in one year.
Anon,
God, you are a pathetic moron.
Oh, excuse me, a pathetic rich moron.
He might be rich (although I doubt it), but he can't buy intelligence or class.
Doomed to remain a racist piece of shite.
I wonder if any those girls he sez he was schtupping knew he's a Nazi.
Different political stripes but in the end: Mol = Anon.
trevor Tutki said...
I wonder if any those girls he sez he was schtupping knew he's a Nazi.
Well, they were apparently dumb enough to go to bed with a guy in a polyester suit, so mebbe they wouldn't mind that either.
Anyway, I suspect he paid for the sex.
Paid for the sex?
How come if he lives in a trailer?
LOL
As I said before, you really don't have a single clue about the sort of person I am.
Thinking about the poor redneck?
Totally wrong!
I´m a young, friendly guy and have many friends in Poland.
I make good money here but respect people and PAY TAXES!
By the way Beatroot, I found the Pan Aryan site only after you mentioned it.
NAZI, RACIST , FASCIST...don´t make me laugh.
Anonymous said...
As I said before, you really don't have a single clue about the sort of person I am.
Oh, he'd like to be believed and accepted... It's almost sad...
Unless someone else writes your posts, we really have a pretty good idea what kind of person you are.
Obnoxious, a fantasist and, let's face it, pretty stupid.
«WE» Who Georgina?
The pseudo-cultural elite that supports RACIST murderers?
BTW Georgina If I were you I would hava a HIV test.
Just in case...
Sorry all.
I meant to write I yanked it 100 times to pictures of Polish women.
My weenie is very small. That's why I have such a thing about Black guys.
Again, sorry to bother you.
I was just kidding with all that racist nonsense. Gee, but I really got you all going, though!
I'm really a nice guy. Please like me.
Man, what a lot of psyhcos out there...
But who wants to be your friend?
Not me for sure!
Ha,
The "news" is that, according to the prosecutors, "an indirect proof" exists that Simon Mol "at least accepted the possibility that he was HIV-positive" (this is my, perhaps inexact translation).
??? Until now, there was no "possibility" about it. The media claimed that he was told in 1999, in the refugee centre, that he was HIV-positive.
As Steppx said, this case will bring many more surprises. I won't be surprised, if it collapses completely.
‘Indirect proof’ sounds like hersay evidence. Which means one or more of the witnesses is claiming that he indicated that he knew he had it.
Maybe.
So if the prosecutors ever do this get to court then it’s going to be his word against theirs.
But ‘indirect evidence’ is very different from the Rzeczpospolita report that he had a test in 1999 and therefore must have been aware that he was HIV positive.
I am not going to post about this again until they charge him one way or another. Everything else is speculative........
Anonymous napisał...
Surprise? Not at all, I met Simon in 2000 and become friends. After a while i reliased he was so irresponsible that i fear walking with him as an african in warsaw.I remember he went after my girl friend after i introduced her to him.He continuosly refused to use "condom" and that for me was enough.
Can you give me a little more details about how you met him, where, when...
Sorry, but I am starting to believe nothing about what some of the comments made here...
The fucking white pigs just got what they deserve. Are they not the originator of AIDS? Mol is a sick man who might not know he is sick and instead of supporting him, you guys starts throwing up all kinds of racist slangs. To hell with you guys. If you think you are superior then you got it coming nazists.
Fucking white pigs?
Kasia
For the black guy who sid:fucking white pigs:
Man jailed for infecting his girlfriend with HIV
By Paul Willis and PA
Last Updated: 1:38am GMT 18/01/2007
A HIV-positive man who pressured his girlfriend in to unprotected sex has been jailed for three and a half years after passing on the virus.
The man, 35, from Zimbabwe, who cannot be named for legal reasons, ignored advice from his GP to use a condom and repeatedly lied to the woman who was worried he might be a carrier.
His health worker eventually contacted the 25-year-old woman and urged her to have a test. When her results came back as positive she contacted police.
The man admitted one count of Grievous Bodily Harm after having unprotected sex and recklessly transmitting HIV.
Judge Roger Jarvis, who recommended the man be deported after serving his sentence, told the hearing at Bournemouth Crown Court: "This crime is a crime which is in many ways beyond comprehension by right thinking people.
"It took place in what to the victim was a loving relationship, but in truth, on your part, there was a callous and cruel deceit."
The court heard the couple met in a nightclub in Bournemouth in May last year, but had known each other from work. The man, who told her was not carrying any sexual diseases, had been diagnosed with HIV in October 2000 and was taking medication which his girlfriend believed was for asthma.
She went to the police after confronting him over her test results and fearing that he might pass on the virus to someone else.
The victim, who has not told her parents or friends, said the virus was not a death sentence but that it was life changing. She said no longer planned to have children.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/01/17/nhiv117.xml
kasia - as I said - I think we have people comming here and putting provocative remarks on the comments just to create trouble.
You stupid racist white,you are the beast in this world.Leave simon alone…
All the negative things from Slavery, WW1 &ww2,Crimes against jews,religious war,and the more modern colonisation came from you.(EUROPE EUROPEANS)i don`t forget how you gave arms to Tutsi for the genocide.You bloody bastard.We were happy in our cave.Happiness never a white have had.You came to corrupt us.I hope you will contract more virus from refugees.Though that virus was created by you,we didn`t know about it.Your cocks are cold like your pussies are ice.Incapable to have orgarms you seek a black warm body.SAD YOU!
Looks like the above is Anon's attempt to front a post as he imagines some African Black guy to think.
Anon: I don't think you can even wank it once let alone a hundred times. I'd be surprised if it takes you less than ten minutes to find it, and then to no avail.
What is this s..t?
Kasia
Hi Guys I just want to know abut what the Politicians with the 'right wing politics'are doing about this? how much wood they are adding to the fire... maybe someone can explain this to me "Poseł LPR: Badać obcokrajowców na obecność HIV" this is anarticle I found , I mean is it plausible?
Danielle Lovey Grant a Mixed Race 23, of Las Vegas is a RAPIST, she and another man used a date rape drug on Victom at 2900 El Camino ave. apt 170, Danielle L Grant sodomized the victim with a plunger, Intestines were hanging out of rectum of victom.She is lite skinned 4 '9 to 4'11 and she drives a black ford Focus, She works as an dental assistant during day. .STOP her please. Victom is too ashamed to go to police, Danielle L Grant MUST BE STOPED her last know ph # 702-685-9588
Post a Comment