Thursday, November 02, 2006

The Sun really is going for it...

Brits are told to get ready for a tidal wave of Romanian gangsters:

ROMANIAN gangs commit 80 to 85 per cent of all cashpoint crime in Britain, The Sun can reveal.

The staggering figure is contained in a secret Cabinet memo which warns the crooks will be joined by a wave of new recruits after Romania and Bulgaria join the EU in January.

The classified document, seen by The Sun, predicts a devastating rise in street violence, people-trafficking, prostitution, tax dodges and cash card fraud.

Gasp! The government memo, apparently written by EU minister Geoff Hoon warns that Romanian and Bulgarian women will be trafficked into the country. Aggressive beggars will threaten money out of the British in the streets. They will steal your mobile, pick your pocket, will smuggle cigarettes and contraband in to the country.

I have no idea how the British government thinks it knows all this. It’s seems incredible. Literally. But Sun readers don’t care: they see an Eastern European apocalypse coming round the corner. In the comments section at the Sun’s web page MarcCoden says:

‘Why have we lost our National identity? Why are we the Country that these people will choose to come to? We are a joke under this Government? Blair is to blame for this and his ridiculous policies.’

Don’t think so, Marc. Actually, more Poles have gone to live and work in Germany than they have to the UK (the figure in the link should read 250,000 by the way). But I am not hearing the same level of screaming about this issue there, even though Poles do not have full rights to work in Germany! And Romanians will probably be joining the 500,000 Romanians already in Italy.

Still, whatever – Eastern Europeans are now well and truly a political issue in Britain. Shame. Immigration is an issue again. And I thought Britain had got rid of this kind of crap years ago.

Now let's watch the left spring into action to defend Eastern Europeans. They have not done much up until now. The silence on the lefty blogs has been deafening.


Eastern Europeans: the new 'white niggers', Spiked, November 3


Jim Jepps said...

We did get rid of this crap for a while - but the papers went into overdrive on asylum seekers around 98, 99 and things have been slipping backwards since then.

I live in damp East Anglia and actually there are a lot of Eastern European workers here doing all the shit jobs that the locals wont touch with a barge pole for money they wont work for.

Unusuaully for the Sun they are actually arguing against what the bosses are saying, CBI included, they want the government to keep streaming in the cheap labour - it helps with divide and rule.

Frank Partisan said...

Should the left put its resources, to fighting a scandal sheet?

Anonymous said...

A simple solution would be to hire thousands of Polish security guards in preparation for the arrival of the Rumanians and Bulgarians.

Seems fear and or photos of large breasted women are able to do wonders for sells in British newspapers.

Jim Jepps said...

Well the Sun is the biggest selling daily in the country - it's also one of the funniest and best written, but for all the wrong reasons.

What's interesting is that even Sun readers don't really take it seriously, but they tacitly accept a lot of what it's saying.

Sometimes the left should ignor what the press is saying - but sometimes it needs to tackle them head on. In this case I think it's important to make the case against immigration controls and racist scapegoating - but sometimes it means more than this.

Newspaper workers last week refused to print an article in another right wing paper because it was an attack on Muslims - it shows that union organisation and direct action can have a direct impact.

beatroot said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
beatroot said...

Welcome Jim Jay. I would have liked to see the Muslim article. What was in it that made people think it was soooo dangerous? Do they think that readers will run out onto the street and commit a pogrom or something.

The Sun should print what it wants. What I am pointing to is that eastern europeans are not, apparently, a group worth defending from the left. Look at the blogs like Harry's Place. Not a peep. Trevor Phillips can make bigoted statements about Poles, as he did last week, and where are the protests about that.

So let the bigots - Phillips and the Sun speak, and then let's tell them they are talking bullshit.

Anonymous said...

JJ wrote: Newspaper workers last week refused to print an article in another right wing paper because it was an attack on Muslims - it shows that union organisation and direct action can have a direct impact.

>>>>> So when will union organization and direct action mobilize in behalf of Eastern European immigrants?

beatroot said...

Well, exactly point enactly. And don't be holding your breath.

The liberal/left are a disaster. Period.

Anonymous said...

But other political movements are just as and even more disasterous.

beatroot said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
beatroot said...

What political movements? I don't see much, Ig Geez. Ziz iz za problem!

We had anti-globalists, but they could not decide whether they wanted to trash MacDonald's or campaign against Speciesism (I am a speciesist, big time!) ..we now have Tree Huggers Against No Frills Airlines Collective...Caliphite in Reykjavik Now! (affiliate of the Anti - Shaving League) ... )….in the US we have ‘Democrats Against the War’ (affiliate of ‘Democrats For the War’)….

….are you still awake? Good. See Iggy, there ain't no real politics anymore. There are populist reactions to things, but nothing that really sets an agenda about what kind of society we should have in the future.

Am I right, or am I right?

Anonymous said...

Post-this, post-that.

The same sh-t's been going on for years and years and years.

When was there politics? When did it end?

Martin said...

Say No To Mullets,

You wrote,

"what difference does it make if i'm mugged or raped by an eastern european or a brit?"

Well, a big 'un, so to speak.

If the United Kingdom had a sensible immigration policy, and did not admit rapists like Viktors Dembovskis, Jozek Kurek or Sylwester Dymowski without checking their backgrounds then your chances of being raped would drop by 50%.

And not only would your chances of enduring a traumatic and life changing experience reduce, but the taxpayer would also be saved the cost of investigating, prosecuting and imprisoning them.

Anonymous said...

I guess there are only something like 6 rapists in the UK. Meaning, I suppose, that the other 3 are Brits. They are obviously as bad as the Poles. Rest of the World, Beware!

beatroot said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
beatroot said...

Martin. I don’t know what you work as but I hope it’s not a criminologist! You seem to have as bizarre a sense of crime and who commits it as does the Sun.

85% of cash point (ATM) crime is done by Romanians? Now how would they be doing that then? Cash point crime goes on from the top to the bottom of the UK. How exactly are these Romanians doing it? There must be a) an enormous amount of Romanians already in the UK (there is not) or b) the few that are there have been using the Space Shttule to get about the place. They must also be on a 24 hour, seven day week, as there is a lot of cash point crime in Britain and if they are 85% responsible for it then they are very hard working immigrants indeed.

And as has been pointed out fanaticfascist, the rape rate in Britain must have increased significantly since 2004 if a sub- population of 500,000 Poles are responsible for 50% of rape crime.

Bizarre. Truly so.

Think about before 1989 and think about today. Notice a difference? You are being ahistorical.

Saying the Sun is shit is like saying water is wet.

Martin said...


No, I'm not a professional criminologist, although I did practice criminal law on and off for seven years.

Re Romanian cash machine crime - please peruse the following links; link fields are activated, so click on the con's name and it will take you to the case report -

An analysis of the scale of cash machine crime perpetrated by Romanians across the world is here -

Re other crime perpetrated by Romanians in the UK, refer to

(the above link refers to the murder in London of a Romanian named Eugen Breahna as part of a feud between rival Romanian gangs which originated from a dispute over control of cash machine crime)


Now, Beatroot, I don't know what you do for a living but I did practice criminal law - I had to cease practice for health reasons (I have Tourette Syndrome).

You may feel inclined to dismiss these cases as one-offs, sexy crimes that make good headlines. Of course, in one sense that's true. Crime sells.

However, there is also a sort of calculus to crime. The above cases are serious indictable crimes. They do not reflect the cases that go unreported - shoplifting, pickpocketing, all the way down to driving without insurance, parking tickets and unpaid TV licences - and the difficulty is that the cost of all these crimes to the citizen and taxpayer mount up.

Citizens provide resources to detect and prevent crime in their own communities. These resources are being diverted away from their original purposes because of an influx of foreigners whose admission has been effected without reference to the same citizens who are left to pick up the bill for the crimes they commit.

Of course there are more than three rapists in the UK - although my original comment was poorly phrsaed, to suggest otherwise is facetious.

The root of my concern is that the UK's screening of migrants is so defective that crimes are being committed unnecessarily. Jozef Kurek had a rape conviction in Poland, was admitted to the UK without question and then perpetrated a rape in Wales. Viktors Demobovskis had served two sentences for rape in Latvia, was admitted to the UK without question and then raped and murdered Jeshma Raithatha in London.

These guys should never have been admitted to the UK in the first place - don't you think? If they hadn't been, some wee Welsh lassie's life wouldn't have been ruined and Jeshma Raithatha would still be alive.

beatroot said...

Martin, following the links on your blog I discover that you are a right wing writer I have encountered in other places. Interesting. You pop up all over the place.

And thanks for mention on your blog. ‘Open goals’? More like an Italian football defense! ‘Going native’…I am always the south London boy, but I will not stand bigotry, I expect it from some on the right, but liberals are noticeably quiet on the issue. Interesting.

I do suppose having Tourette Syndrome would be inconvenient when practicing criminal law! But seriously, what did you think of the Big Brother thing? Was that good or bad? And why do the British watch that shit?

I do think Romanians have been an over reported crime group. That’s the way media works. 99% of normal Romanians leading decent lives is NOT A STORY. But the Romanian dodgy geezer is. And as the EU date gets nearer it gets to be even of a sexy story.

And I repeat: what are we so scared of? Romanians are the least of the UK’s problems. Big strong country! Snigger

Martin said...

Beatroot, I have no problem being described as rightwing, if only because I know what it really means.

Bring on the Tory cuts!

And do you not realise what bloody hard work it is being an Irish Catholic right wing writer in Glasgow? The number of bases you have to cover, the volume of fallacies you have to burst? God's sake, Beatroot, cut me some slack!

Open goals...Italian defence...ha Italian defence is only as good as the other side's free kick specialist...

If you're either implying I'm a bigot or accusing me of bigotry, let me remind you, Beatroot, I'm a Glaswegian. Such denunciations are water off a duck's back. When you have grown up listening to 40,000 Rangers fans shoutng that they're up their knees in Fenian (your) blood every second Saturday from August to May you develop a thick skin for these things. I hold the view that inward migration has reached the extent where to continue it at the same level will harm the national interest, and the balance of the material I post reflects that view - how does that make me a bigot?

When you mention Big Brother, I presume you're referring to Pete Burns, the Tourette sufferer who won this year? What little I saw of it (I'm not a fan) reminded me to be very grateful that my symptoms are not as severe as his, poor soul.

Why does anyone watch anything? Hype and prurience, I suppose.

BTW, in respect of our employment market we Brits have nothing to be scared of from Romanian migration. The sectors in which they're being permitted to work, agriculture and food proccessing, are already chock full of '04 migrants. It's Poles working in Britain who're going to feel the pinch.

beatroot said...

The comparison with Spain is interesting and one I use a lot. Both Poland and Spain have 40 million people, both ‘95%’ ‘Catholic’, both societies recovering from dictatorship. Spain have a lead over Poland by 15 years (1974 being their year of freedom). And now there is ‘gay marriage’ in Spain.

As far as the racial prejudices go however, Spain is not a good role model. The nastiness of racial abuse at football grounds there is as bad as it is in Italy.

But the important thing about slightly primitive prejudiuces in eatern Europe is nothing to do with religion, it’s to do woth the experience of communism, which cut the culture off from a natural exposure to different peoples.

Still Trevor Phillips, and the typical British liberal, feels it’s OK to lecture eastern Europeans, to pick on Eastern Europeans. Well, it isn’t. The Head of the CRE is a bigot. It could only happen in the UK!

beatroot said...

And Martin, my fire is really being aimed at the left/liberals. Like I say, I don't expect many conservatives to be into free borders (although the libertarian right I would expect more from - trouble is: the libertarian right is marginal, to say the least, in Britain. But the old style JS Mill liberalism is dead in Britain....they are more authoritarian than much of the right.


Martin said...

Say No To Mullets,

That is one plug ugly screen image you've got there...

You write,

"you talk about taxes being some kind of factor here, i hate to break it to you: what was it?? those 2 certanties in life.....yes, martin - taxes and death! therefore, why must i concern myself with who does what?"

You can concern yourself with whatever you like, hen, but I dislike resourcing police services for the prevention and detection and crime in our communities and those resources being used to detect crimes being committed by foreigners upon whose rights of residence I have been given no say.

That's not fair on me - is it? Come on, now, that isn't fair, is it?

You continue,

"you are sensationalising the fact that 50% of crime happens because of immigrants. in the style of beatroot,(and all other lovely academics), please show me in terms of statistics where E.U's are giving us all the shite....

Where have I said that? Where?

Your unnecessary coarseness aside, I would merely remind you that Mark Twain, who coined the phrase 'there is nothing certain in life except death and taxes' also wrote that there were three types of lies; lies, damned lies and statistics.

My study of crime committed by foreigners is unscientific and anecdotal - I SAY AS MUCH MYSELF - -

but there seems to be a hell of a lot of it and I'm expected to pay for cleaning up after it.

BTW, the argument that your brother is a criminal lawyer who's never met a Pole is a classic non sequitur. Your brother has not met a Pole - therefore Poles do not commit crimes.



You're deinitely right about Islam provoding the greater cultural challenge. Islam's philosophy is so radically different from Judaeo-Christian, occidental values that a clash, or as I prefer to call it a skirmish, of civilisations is inevitable.

What is disquieting about Polish migration is both its speed and scale. This is a movement of people of a kind never before seen in history. We are in uncharted waters...

beatroot said...

I like Mullets'freckles!

beatroot said...

Oh, and Martin, you are not being expected to pay for any crime committed by immigrants. They pay taxes etc...and don;t forget: immigrants make up 8% of British society but contribute over 10% of GDP

Rejoice my freind, rejoice...

Anonymous said...

Well, it seems some folks in the US have similar ideas about Polish immigrants (even if the article was aiming at yuppies, and attempts to be critical of their attitudes against Polish immigrants, it still misses its mark and instead will only serve to reinforce and even embolden bigotry).

The Black Squirrel's Burden -- Haverford Alumni Magazine
by David Langlieb '05

What separates a Haverford education from a Yale education or a University of Phoenix education? You guessed it: A commitment to
social and civic responsibility. This is why after graduating from
Haverford in 2005 I decided to move to a neighborhood where I knew I could make a difference. That neighborhood was Greenpoint, Brooklyn.

Greenpoint is a tightly knit, working class, semi-urban community of first- and second-generation Polish immigrants. It's the kind of place where the old ladies shop at Gus's Fruit Stand instead of Wal-Mart, and parents take their kids to the park on Sunday nights to play softball and drink lemonade. Communities like Greenpoint are a dying breed in America, and thank God for that.

Try ordering a Venti Caramel
Macchiato at the Franklin Street coffee shop and you'll see what I
mean. While the community has several problems, most of them come back to the high density of Polish people infesting its rowhouses. Mocking Poles for being stupid is perhaps the last form of politically correct prejudice, as well as the most accurate. The other day I asked a local Polak shopkeeper if he'd heard the one about the Polish guy who tried
to fill up his gas tank by driving the car in reverse. The shopkeeper
didn't respond because he'd accidentally put his pants on his head that morning and
the waistband was cutting off his hearing.

I'm kidding, of course, but Greenpoint's problems are no laughing matter, and they won't be solved by teaching the locals how to wear pants. The Greenpoint business district, for example, is even uglier than the morons who work there. Shoddy hand-made signage pollutes the storefront windows, and some of the signs aren't even in English. A
friendly corporate logo or two would do wonders for the place.

The good news is that it looks like they're opening a Blimpie on Calyer Street, where Ula's Deli used to reside. I'm not sure what they're doing with Ula, but maybe if she promises to clean her ears once in awhile they'll let her work the cash register.

Amidst these modest improvements are a few old-school New York charms. I'll admit that I was kind of intrigued by the bearded alcoholic homeless man who lives outside the subway station. That was cute for about five minutes. But day after day with the nonsensical screaming and the pointing... get over yourself, buddy.

So why do I live in Greenpoint? Because if I didn't, then it wouldn't get any better. Oh sure, I could move to SoHo or the Upper East Side like some of my fellow Haverford graduates who care only about themselves. But those places have already been saved and they don't need my help. If my Haverford education has taught me anything, it's
that social change doesn't happen overnight. You must, if necessary,
be willing to endure months of living without a Lord & Taylor in the immediate area.
Not to toot my own horn, but I've done wonders for the community. My
non-ethnic whiteness, above average hygiene, and dependable income have already attracted new investments to Greenpoint. Private
developers are within months of breaking ground on a massive high-rise condominium complex on the Greenpoint waterfront. There'll be a rooftop pool, a fitness center, and gorgeous views of the Manhattan skyline from across the East River. It's not quite perfect -- a small
percentage of the apartments will go to low-income families but nine
tenths of a loaf is better than none.

One thing I do worry about is that Greenpoint will gentrify
incorrectly. This is what's happening in adjacent Williamsburg, where the Hasidic Jews are being displaced by hipsters. Sure, their parents
give them enough money to keep the neighborhood looking decent, but
the new population is almost as annoying as the old one. And yes, they do wear suits and ties sometimes, but only to be ironic. No thank you.

I'd hate to see that happen to Greenpoint, because it has so much
potential. It's a place I'd like to raise my kids: Within a stone's
throw of Manhattan, amidst lawyers and investment bankers, and as shut off from civil society as humanly possible. I dream of a Greenpoint where Banana Republic is open all night, where groceries are ordered over the Internet, and where the churches are converted to mixed-use parking facilities.

Mine is a Greenpoint of the future, sensitive to
the desires of its residents who so desperately need a racquet club
and driving range. Or who will,
anyway, after the vermin are gone.
So join me, my fellow Greenpointians. That is, if you're literate enough to understand what I've written.

David Langlieb

Martin said...


Remember what i saud about open goals?

"immigrants make up 8% of British society but contribute over 10% of GDP"

Is that gross GDP? How much has it increased GDP per capita?

beatroot said...

'It' meaning immigration as a whoie, or Polish immigration?

Martin said...


As a whole.

Mullets, my dear, my missus is Irish.

I shall say no more...

beatroot said...

I am taking the reference to Gross GDP as inferring costs of immigration.

If so then Ernst and Young calculate that Poles are net tax contributors. The Institute for Public Policy says migrants are profitable: for every £100 in taxes paid by the average British-born person, the average new immigrant pays £112.

the number of people in work grew by 42,000 over the three months to March 2006 and by 240,000 over the year, to reach 28.94 million - the highest number of people in work since records began in 1971.

The annual growth rate in average earnings excluding bonuses, was 3.9 per cent in June 2006, up 0.1 per cent on the previous month. Including bonuses wages grew by 4.3 per cent, up 0.2 per cent on the previous month.

I could go on. It’s true that an increase of immigrants will have negative effects in some areas – of course – but on the whole, on aggregate – immigration to Britain by Poles etc (and before after the war it had a massive benefit to a depleted workforce) is a positive thing for the economy and a positive development culturally as well.

Shame all the cultures don’t share one positive identity, however. But that’s the liberal left. It almost makes me nostalgic for class politics.

Martin said...


Sorry it took some time to get back to you.

I wrote a very long (5,000)word analysis of all this back in February -

To (selectively) quote -

"Mr. Blair mentioned a Treasury analysis that the economic growth rate would be 0.5% less if migration ceased for the next two years. Immigration certainly does increase GDP because the more people there are working the more the economic output will be, but most of the increase in GDP goes to the immigrants themselves. What matter to native workers is not GDP, but GDP per capita: they don’t care how big the economy is, but how rich they are. A US Government study found that while immigration had increased the US GDP by $200bn a year, actually only between $1bn and $10 bn of this went to the workers already in the US, a trivial mount compared to the $8,000 bn US economy, with the rest going in pay to the immigrants themselves. In total, immigration only increased US GDP growth by 0.1 per cent a year, a trivial amount.”

Gross GDP is one of those things where, to coin a phrase, size doesn't matter. It's unfortunate that the Chancellor of the Exchequer seems to think it does.

I'm aware of some the IPPR's writings on immigration. Last year they wrote a document called 'Paying Their Way', the link to which has since disappeared behind a firewall - I quoted it directly in the above piece -

" – total revenue from immigrants grew in real terms from £33.8 billion in 1999-2000 to £41.2 billion in 2003-4. This 22% increase compares with a 6% increase for those born in the UK.
- immigrants made up 8.7% of the population in 2003-4 but accounted for 10.2% of all income tax collected
- immigrants earn about 15% more in average weekly income than those born in the UK
- each immigrant generated £7, 203 in government revenue on average in 2003-4, compared with £6, 861 per non-immigrant
- each immigrant accounted for £7, 277 of government expenditure on average compared with £7,753 per non immigrant. "

I critiqued them thus-

"As positive as these figures might seem, they have three glaring flaws.

The first is that although ‘Paying their way’ does make reference to the number of migrants who have settled since the eastward expansion of the EU in May 2004, it makes no reference to the fact that the country has had a net migrant inflow of 151, 000 (if one believes John Bercow) or 166,000 (if one believes Migration Watch) every year between 1999-2000 and 2003-2004. Increases on such a scale should automatically raise the amount of revenue raised from migrants even without the operation of migration’s other possible effects, such as native worker displacement.

The second is that in their reporting of relative levels of taxation collected and income earned, the authors adopt the broadest of broad-brush approaches, throwing all migrants into the same pot. The permanent residence in London of high numbers of both very high net worth and very low net worth migrants might by themselves have some impact. One could wonder what a similar study that failed to report both the incomes earned by and taxes collected from Lakshmi Mittal and Boris Berezovsky would look like.

The third is that ‘Paying their way’ only shows monies in and monies out; ledger entries.

(Anthony)Browne, writing on the eve of the Eastern cascade which commenced on May 1 2004, adopted a very much more direct approach to the question of immigration’s costs:

“It is a matter of both common sense and academic analysis that immigration at the current rate to the UK…. has an impact on the housing market, increasing shortages and pushing up rents and house prices and thus reducing labour mobility. By boosting the population, it also increases congestion on roads and public transport, exacerbating the shortage of land for factories and offices, further damaging the economy. In compensation, the economies of scale of increasing the population through increasing the size of the domestic market are marginal in an open trading economy like the UK”.

I'm afraid I have no trust in anything any business writes about the benefits of migration. All want to reduce labour costs.

In respect of the number in work, read this -


and this

My analyses of the growth rate in earnings can be found here

and here

Notes on culture can be found at -

The class war had a lot going for it, Beatroot. At least the old left stood on the side of the British working class in those days.

Will ye no' come back again, Ernie Bevin?

beatroot said...

Cheers Mart, I will chew over all that...and you are strangly right about the old class war. When class was taken out of left politics (at least class united people over 'identity') then it collapsed into multiculturalism, where our individual 'cultures' seems to be stuck to us like a third arm, or whatever. But class ain;t coming back into politics again. No more Bevin or Bevan...

Anonymous said...

Not all romanians steal (I for one don't, except from the orchard apples from childhood, but who didn't), but there are many of us that see going to another country as the jackpot, then, when there, with no money, do desperate things. The ones that go to foreign lands with the precise goal of stealing (or worse) are not that many to get all romanians labeled as "robbers", "muggers" or worse. And they usually did the exact things here, but for less "income", and with higher risks, as I suppose the guards of a store, for example, wouldn't beat the living daylight out of someone for trying to steal something (it's not general, but there were cases).

I for one would like to see your country some day, but I hope this generalisation of romanians will not be widely-spread amongst the citizens, to get looked at as if I were a criminal.

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